End of season post-mortem begins

[Kenny_Senior]

After our poorest season in the Championship to date, I hope SO'D is going to carry out a thorough root and branch analysis of what went wrong this season, both on and off the pitch.

Despite avoiding relegation we have plunged alarmingly down the table in the second half of the season, failed to reach the basic target of 50 points and left ourselves asking more questions than there is answers at the moment.

In short, I draw the following conclusions from this season:

- Defensively we were completely inadequate all season.
- We lack strength in depth, something that was evident during the injury crisis.
- We don't have enough players.
- There is a huge inbalance in wages, which severely affected us in the transfer market when we were trying to bring in new players.

However, there is a few positives, such as:

- We are still competative when attacking and score our fair share of goals.
- We appear to have a good team spirit and togetherness.

To draw a few more conclusions, I think it may work to our benefit during the summer if the club sold Billy Sharp. He is undoubtedly the biggest playing assett that we have, but at the same time he is probably the one player who significantly raises the bar in terms of what we pay in wages.

If Sharp is sold, then although I fear the transfer fee received would help to pay off a substantial amount of the financial deficeit that the club has suffered this season, it may also make us more able to flex our arm in the transfer market because of the money we save on his wages.

It would not be an ideal situation, but my fear is that if we retain Sharp it may result in us failing to properly address any of the glaring and outstanding frailities (i.e. the defence) that we have, over the course of the summer. Should we fail to address these huge problems properly, then we will be relegated next season.

It seems inevitable that nobody on the board is going to pump in \"mega money\" so that we can compete with more established teams in the division who have bigger wage bills and can attract better quality players.

Therefore, having to \"sell before we can buy\" seems inevitable too.

[donnygreenjeans]

Firstly, you may have a point about sharp's wages but i've got to disagree with you on selling sharp, it is no surprise that we have severly missed sharp and his goals in the second part of the season, IMO i believe we wouldn't be in 21st position if sharp had been fit and playing, i can recall the number of games where our strikers have missed the target that sharp would have scored. And secondly why would you sell your best player, doesn't make sense (unless the club receive an offer they can't refuse, how many times as a club sold their best player and struggled?

[Chrisd_123]

I don't think it's a case of \"sell before we buy\", it's more a case of \"get rid of deadwood before we sign players\"... Selling the likes of Billy Sharp should not even be thought about, what SOD and JR need to do is sit down and be ruthless with the squad.

Today just summed our whole season up, looked good going forward with no finish without Sharp, and woeful at the back. They need to just clear out all the deadwood to bring in new blood.

Thank god Thomas played today as he reminded us of how bad he actually is and he's one to go for sure. We need to be a bit harsh and not think twice about being loyal to some of them as i'm sure staying up is much more important than giving someone an extra year because they've done this or that once. Pretty much every player out of contract needs to go and then free up the wages for new bodies to come in and please, DO NO sign Killgallon for god sake.

[Norfolk N Chance]

Been thinking that Friend is such a good player perhaps he bene making everyone around him look good - Think we have the answer!

I don't think it's a case of \"sell before we buy\", it's more a case of \"get rid of deadwood before we sign players\"... Selling the likes of Billy Sharp should not even be thought about, what SOD and JR need to do is sit down and be ruthless with the squad.

Today just summed our whole season up, looked good going forward with no finish without Sharp, and woeful at the back. They need to just clear out all the deadwood to bring in new blood.

Thank god Thomas played today as he reminded us of how bad he actually is and he's one to go for sure. We need to be a bit harsh and not think twice about being loyal to some of them as i'm sure staying up is much more important than giving someone an extra year because they've done this or that once. Pretty much every player out of contract needs to go and then free up the wages for new bodies to come in and please, DO NO sign Killgallon for god sake.

[george-friend]

I don't think it's a case of \"sell before we buy\", it's more a case of \"get rid of deadwood before we sign players\"... Selling the likes of Billy Sharp should not even be thought about, what SOD and JR need to do is sit down and be ruthless with the squad.

Today just summed our whole season up, looked good going forward with no finish without Sharp, and woeful at the back. They need to just clear out all the deadwood to bring in new blood.

Thank god Thomas played today as he reminded us of how bad he actually is and he's one to go for sure. We need to be a bit harsh and not think twice about being loyal to some of them as i'm sure staying up is much more important than giving someone an extra year because they've done this or that once. Pretty much every player out of contract needs to go and then free up the wages for new bodies to come in and please, DO NO sign Killgallon for god sake.[/quote]

That boy is quality,clearly short on confidence but im telling you that boy is excactly what we need.

[Chrisd_123]

I'm not convinced by him. I would love him to sign if he had shown us something half decent while he was here when he played but surely it's too risky to take a player like Killgallon who's injured quite often, on big wages and never really made an impact on loan like Sharp did. I'd much rather us go try someone else on a cheaper/less risky deal.

[george-friend]

I'm not convinced by him. I would love him to sign if he had shown us something half decent while he was here when he played but surely it's too risky to take a player like Killgallon who's injured quite often, on big wages and never really made an impact on loan like Sharp did. I'd much rather us go try someone else on a cheaper/less risky deal.

But he has not been given a chance like Billy was ?
I am almost certain that he will come good if we sign him

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

I'm not convinced by him. I would love him to sign if he had shown us something half decent while he was here when he played but surely it's too risky to take a player like Killgallon who's injured quite often, on big wages and never really made an impact on loan like Sharp did. I'd much rather us go try someone else on a cheaper/less risky deal.

But he has not been given a chance like Billy was ?
I am almost certain that he will come good if we sign him

And the reason for that?  Whenever he's played he's looked dis-interested and to be honest hasn't done much at all.  I'd rather see a younger defender with the attributes we need.  Compare Killgallon to Friend, Friend was supposedly a left back, he's done far better at centre half than Killgallon, is younger and is ours.  Killgallon for the experience he has and the money we have gambled on him has been shocking.  Just look at the invitation left for goal 3 today, ridiculous.

[Chrisd_123]

I'm not convinced by him. I would love him to sign if he had shown us something half decent while he was here when he played but surely it's too risky to take a player like Killgallon who's injured quite often, on big wages and never really made an impact on loan like Sharp did. I'd much rather us go try someone else on a cheaper/less risky deal.

But he has not been given a chance like Billy was ?
I am almost certain that he will come good if we sign him

And the reason for that?  Whenever he's played he's looked dis-interested and to be honest hasn't done much at all.  I'd rather see a younger defender with the attributes we need.  Compare Killgallon to Friend, Friend was supposedly a left back, he's done far better at centre half than Killgallon, is younger and is ours.  Killgallon for the experience he has and the money we have gambled on him has been shocking.  Just look at the invitation left for goal 3 today, ridiculous.

Exactly...There has to be a reason why he hasn't been played. He's supposedly a prem class player yet he couldn't get a game infront of Thomas and Martis!! Too risky imo to sign him.

[Padge_DRFC]

Probably be a good idea if they are going to get excited by 2.5 million for the best championship striker in the league and sell him, then at least do it at the end of the summer when people have bought their season tickets to watch Euell want everything on a plate.

[Jonathan]

Selling Sharp would be catastrophic. It would hugely weaken the team, send out the wrong message to other key players we want to keep, the wrong message to players we are trying to attract, and would be suicidal to the attempts to persuade supporters to buy season tickets.

Too many people have been playing Football Manager if they think we could sell Sharp for (just as an example) £2.5 million and then go out and spend £1 million on a replacement striker, £500,000 each on two centre halves and another £500,000 on a midfielder. It simply wouldn't happen. Selling Sharp would not give us any scope to strenthen the squad, just like selling Mills and Wellens didn't. Selling your best players weakens the team and weakens the standing of the club in the local community.

We have to keep Sharp and other key players, and build on what we have. I'm confident we will.

[BigH]

Sorry people. At £10k a week it's got to be better than 'I'm sure he'll come good'. £10k a week would pay the weekly wages of the best two centre backs in League 1 or the Scottish Premier (outside Rangers/Celtic) by the way.

[grayx]

Sorry people. At £10k a week it's got to be better than 'I'm sure he'll come good'. £10k a week would pay the weekly wages of the best two centre backs in League 1 or the Scottish Premier (outside Rangers/Celtic) by the way.

I must agree there.

[BigH]

Sorry Jon, but I disagree with your argument that we effectively build a team around Sharp. Look, I think he's a great player, the best striker in a Rovers shirt since Kitchen. But I'm afraid that we have deep seated problems in the squad and there will be a radical overhaul in the close season. There has to be. Billy only played two thirds of the season and there was no replacement when he was injured. In fact no one anywhere near.

The latest cash settlement for the Football League means Rovers are going to coin £2-3m per season for the next 3 seasons, assuming they remain in the Championship. We get 10k crowds. The sums don't add up. We need to think differently.

[Jonathan]

My point is that selling Sharp would not strengthen the squad. It is delusional to think the funds would be used to make us stronger, they weren't when we sold Wellens or Mills, and the same would go for Sharp.

I agree that changes are needed in the squad, but that should not involve offloading top players. There's enough rubbish and mediocrity to clear away without disrupting the important components.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Spot on, we can't lost the little quality we do have.  However, will it become the only possibility?  We really need to find some gems this summer and I feel we're paying the price for not finding good young players like other clubs have.  I mean look at Swansea as an example.  They have bought better than we have in the market and last summer we were too focussed on one player.  This summer we have to look at a variety of options.

[Kenny_Senior]

Spot on, we can't lost the little quality we do have.  However, will it become the only possibility?

I think it may have already become one of the only possibilities. This season the club will have finished at a financial loss of at least £2M+. Unless the board are willing to fund that shortfall in its entirety, then we would have to sell. I do agree that if Billy Sharp is sold then it would make the club even less attractive and fashionable to the average punter. But the problem is that crowds have dropped off in each of the last three seasons yet the wage bill has risen significantly, so what is the option? Sign players on big money in the hope of doing a Blackpool or something similar, or ultimately become a selling club? Either way its a vicious circle but the figures don't add up at the moment.

If we sold Sharp, then the money we save on his wages could be used to attract a couple of decent players in other positions. We can forget seeing any of the transfer fee we would receive for him as that'll be used to pay off the debts.

[jonnydog]

New players definately need to be brought in during the close-season. We need to move fast and basically not fcuk about. IMO Billys position in the team is in no way in question... Make no mistake, their IS affordable quality there to sort the majority of our problems, but speed of a signature is of the essence!!!

... It might sound negative (though it's certainly not meant to!!), but my guts telling me that the 2011/12 season could be the 'make or break' season for us in the championship... Make a hash of it early on and we're fckued (... What? proper fcukd?!?). Changes are vital within the team both on AND OFF the field. No one player is THE answer. SOD knows this, so i am CONFIDENT we will do the right thing!!!

(tonights optimism brought to you by Newcastle Brown, Jacky D's and several brands of Tequilla & Raki).

[Savvy]

My point is that selling Sharp would not strengthen the squad. It is delusional to think the funds would be used to make us stronger, they weren't when we sold Wellens or Mills, and the same would go for Sharp.

I agree that changes are needed in the squad, but that should not involve offloading top players. There's enough rubbish and mediocrity to clear away without disrupting the important components.

Spot on! Selling Sharp would be throwing the baby out with the bath water. The manager has managed to put another rabbit from out of his hat and found 3 teams that are worse than us this season. Without a clearout and substantial investment we should prepare for the inevitable!

[Jonathan]

so what is the option? Sign players on big money in the hope of doing a Blackpool or something similar, or ultimately become a selling club?

To \"do a Blackpool\" would not involve signing players on big money as you put it. They splashed out big money on one particular key player (Charlie Adam) and the rest of the team was built around smart moves in the transfer market. They brought in players that had proved themsleves to be quality, hungry, ambitious players often from lower level clubs (take the likes of Evatt, Baptiste, Barker, Eardley, Taylor-Fletcher etc.) along with using the loan market well.

We have already done the bit of splashing out on the stand-out player (Sharp), and we have the building blocks of a strong team around him (O'Connor, Friend, Stock (if fit), Martin Woods, Oster, Coppinger, Gillett and a few more besides). The problem is that when injuries have hit, including to Sharp, the quality of the squad has not run deep enough and we've ended up resorting to too many Wayne Thomas type players (signed at the end of the summer after nobody else wanted him) instead of getting in early to attract the quality Bosman signings and/or promising players from the leagues below.

There are players around that fit the bill. Just as examples, Murphy, Mirfin, Kilkenny, Chris Taylor etc. etc. The list could go on and it's not the job of the fans to pick the players, but there must be quality players about that will either not cost transfer fees, or could be tempted from the leagues below. We just need to be proactive rather than waiting and waiting and waiting.

[ravenrover]

Does anyone want to tell me where the knowledge of Sharps or any other players wages comes from? Is £10k per week speculation? Do we KNOW what Oster or Copps or Stock is on per week? Would the savings on these immense wages make that much difference in relation to other players we could bring in? Lets face it any transfer funds from selling the like of Sharp or Copps would not be re-invested in several new faces the Board, and fair due to them, cannot be expected to bankroll the club season after season,
There are players out there who could fill some of our problem areas and their wage demands surely wouldn't break the bank of our wage structure, whatever that might be!
Our problem is that SOD will not buy, on past seasons dealings, the type of player that some of our posters, and I am one, seem to think we need to make a srong challenge next season.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Sorry Jon, but I disagree with your argument that we effectively build a team around Sharp. Look, I think he's a great player, the best striker in a Rovers shirt since Kitchen. But I'm afraid that we have deep seated problems in the squad and there will be a radical overhaul in the close season. There has to be. Billy only played two thirds of the season and there was no replacement when he was injured. In fact no one anywhere near.

Actually that's not entirely correct. Between him getting injured against Sheff Utd and comin gback vs Palace last Autumn, we won 8 points from 5 games  - that was play-off form and equalled our best run of the season.

We proved in that little cameo, just as we proved in the second half of 2008-09 that we can both play good football, score goals and win games without Billy Sharp in the side. He is a superb player but he is NOT indispensible.

The problem for the side this season came NOT when Sharp was injured, but when so many other players were injured that we were down to the bare bones. Even having Sharp in the side did not stop us from turning in a whole string of woeful performances and/or getting arseholed when we were stretched everywhere else on the pitch (matches against Leicester, Barnsley, Portsmouth, Leeds, Reading are the obvious ones that come to mind as the rot set in).

Seems to me that there is a clear and obvious lesson to draw.

If Sharp plays and we have our first choice squad fit, we are a match for anyone bar maybe the top 4 or 5 in the division.

If we have a bad run of injuries, we are relegation fodder whether Sharp plays or doesn't play.

But, crucially, as we have shown at other times, IF we have a balanced side, we can compete with the best in this division even without Sharp.

Getting that balanced side and some back up of an ability above the Webster/Burge/Souza level is the crucial task for next season. If we lack that back-up, we're two or three key injuries away from a season-long relegation scrap. Whether Sharp plays or not.