SOD to retire

[pubteam]

When saunders came to us and Wolves he had all this talk about the playoffs, then got us relegated and has led wolves from mid table to second from bottom. It's one thing saying things it's another actually doing them.

I'm sorry but Wolves were not mid-table when he took over.

[Filo]

When saunders came to us and Wolves he had all this talk about the playoffs, then got us relegated and has led wolves from mid table to second from bottom. It's one thing saying things it's another actually doing them.

I'm sorry but Wolves were not mid-table when he took over.

Damn you! putting facts in the way of a good knifing!

[DonnyOsmond]

These SOD lovers love getting a SOD v Saunders thread going. It also ends up being SOD's the son of Jesus and is the greatest manager ever and Saunders is worse than a blind deaf mute at managing.

[CusworthRovers]

Reading this thread it seems as though its the Anti SOD brigade that have turned a simple thread about Sean into the usual 'he did, he didn't' b*llocks.

As a pointer I seem to recall it was a change in our youth structure that changed when Sean came here. I don't know if this was his idea or a board decision or both.

It may be that Wakefield and others have come through from the new youth system that was set back then.

Sean did go to the Youth set up as I saw him there.

There is a big hang up re youth and its always a good bit of PR to spout positives about it. In reality the higher the club, the better the players, the more difficult it is to then break through. We had a very successful team under Sean and it would have been very hard to break through. That said, be they from other clubs or not Sean did utilise youth in Nelly, Hird, Woods, Fairhurst,.....and a couple of lads made the squad in Pacey and the CH who made one or two sub appearances, had a loan spell (name forgets me)

[RedJ]

When saunders came to us and Wolves he had all this talk about the playoffs, then got us relegated and has led wolves from mid table to second from bottom. It's one thing saying things it's another actually doing them.

Don't talk b*llocks they were in decline when he got there. Your f**king hero's done brill for City, eh?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Pubteam

Thank you. I'm glad somebody else can see the bleeding obvious.

[Chris]

When saunders came to us and Wolves he had all this talk about the playoffs, then got us relegated and has led wolves from mid table to second from bottom. It's one thing saying things it's another actually doing them.

Don't talk b*llocks they were in decline when he got there. Your f***ing hero's done brill for City, eh?

I follow Bristol City as they're one of my local-ish teams. They were doomed long before O'Driscoll took the job and if they don't get their finances in order things will only get worse.

[dickos1]

Funny how Bristol were doomed but wolves were midtable

[Chris]

Funny how Bristol were doomed but wolves were midtable

Wolves were 16th weren't they? Bristol were bottom. Also, compare their squads.

[DonnyOsmond]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

[RedJ]

Wolves were in freefall... hence the sacking of Solbakken.

[Chris]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

[pubteam]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

I would not call a squad containing players like Sam Baldock, Albert Adomah, Steve Davies, Tom Heaton, Jon Stead etc. 'terrible', but there you go. Perhaps 'lacking in decent defenders' might be more appropriate.

Also, I'm pretty sure that Wolves had slipped down to about 20th by the time Saunders was appointed. I don't suppose the specific position matters too much with the Championship being so close.

[wilts rover]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

add to Pubteams list Neil Killkenny, Brian Howard, Stephen Pearson, Marvin Elliott, Lewin Nyatanga you are looking at a number of experienced internationals and others who are certainly Championship quality there. They might not be as good a squad as Man U or City - but are they any worse than Barnsley, Huddersfield, Millwall, Charlton or Peterborough for instance?
If you live in the area you will know that Sean is beginning to get slated for the same things he was here, performances better than results, playing only one striker, having only one striker and not using the loan window (players have to be better than what we have). He will certainly get the summer to rebuild, but rest assured neither the City fans nor Lansdowne will give him the time or patience that John Ryan did.
I cant imagine Wolves giving it to Deano either if they are hanging around the bottom of the league again next year.
I hope they both do well, but you would be struggling to say that either has been a success since leaving us.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

Aye. And that Forest squad he inherited, that included Camp, Collins, Guerdioura, Reid, Blackstock, Tudgay, McGugan, McGoldrick, Majewski etc, etc. Apparently that was crap as well.

And clearly the Rovers squad he inherited was crap. The one that had just gone into the last match of the season with a chance if the play-offs, and had Roberts, O'Connor and Lockwood added in the close season.

[Chris]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

Aye. And that Forest squad he inherited, that included Camp, Collins, Guerdioura, Reid, Blackstock, Tudgay, McGugan, McGoldrick, Majewski etc, etc. Apparently that was crap as well.

And clearly the Rovers squad he inherited was crap. The one that had just gone into the last match of the season with a chance if the play-offs, and had Roberts, O'Connor and Lockwood added in the close season.

I'd argue he did fairly well at Forest before being sacked incredibly harshly.

Forest weren't bottom at the half-way point of the season when he took over either. We also weren't bottom at the half-way point of the season when he took over. There was a massive difference between the circumstances in which SO'D took over at Doncaster and Forest and the circumstances which he found himself at Bristol City. I genuinely don't believe that anyone could have kept that Bristol City team up this season. I said as much when O'Driscoll got the job.

[MachoMadness]

SO'D was never appointed to keep City up, that much was obvious. He was appointed because he has a reputation (whether you think it's deserved or not) for delivering attractive football on a moderate budget. They clearly want to go down so they can have a clearout, but want a firm footing on which they can rebuild from scratch. Of course, whether the SO'D model of football can actually be sustained on low/moderate budget a few years down the line is another debate, certainly he couldn't manage that here.

I don't understand why people seem to be jumping on Deano though, after all he did for us. Yeah, he took us down. We were in freefall anyway. Does anybody remember the last 8 months or so under SO'D? I certainly do. That football 'identity' that everyone bangs on about was nowhere to be seen, unless our identity was as a team who'd pass it along the back four for 20 seconds then lump it up to Sharp/Euell/Brown/Moussa etc. We were heading nowhere fast. SO'D was undoubtedly the greatest manager we had in my lifetime, but he had plenty of faults and they eventually all caught up with him at once. Deano was the right man for the job, I'm glad we went down under Saunders because nobody was keeping us up and Deano was absolutely the perfect man to take us back up again, this time stronger. He had a vision of a successful team at this level and he built that team just as well as SO'D did back in 07/08.

SO'D and Saunders are two different people with different football philosophies, neither of them gave us an 'identity' because DRFC should have it's own identity. They've both been successful in their own way, and I'm sure they have and will both fail in their own ways too. Saunders' legacy with Rovers is every bit as important as Sean O'Driscoll's.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Yeah. SOD had it tough with that team with a £25 million wage bill.

I think it's closer to £18m. Regardless, that Bristol City squad is terrible and it was terrible before SO'D took over.

Aye. And that Forest squad he inherited, that included Camp, Collins, Guerdioura, Reid, Blackstock, Tudgay, McGugan, McGoldrick, Majewski etc, etc. Apparently that was crap as well.

And clearly the Rovers squad he inherited was crap. The one that had just gone into the last match of the season with a chance if the play-offs, and had Roberts, O'Connor and Lockwood added in the close season.

I'd argue he did fairly well at Forest before being sacked incredibly harshly.

Forest weren't bottom at the half-way point of the season when he took over either. We also weren't bottom at the half-way point of the season when he took over. There was a massive difference between the circumstances in which SO'D took over at Doncaster and Forest and the circumstances which he found himself at Bristol City. I genuinely don't believe that anyone could have kept that Bristol City team up this season. I said as much when O'Driscoll got the job.

I'm afraid you're missing the point Chris. The point I was making is that there are folk on here who have consistently claimed that O'Driscoll has taken over nothing but teams down on their uppers. We had folk here earlier this season saying what a sterling job he was doing at Forest having inherited a squad that was very poor. I suggest that a squad that had the players listed above already in it, to which were added Sharp, Cox, Ayala, Lansbury, Halford, Jenas, Ward and Harding was a very expensive and very well equipped one - even for Championship level.

That's all I was arguing. Whether he did well, badly or indifferently with those players is for others to judge.

[pubteam]

SO'D was never appointed to keep City up, that much was obvious. He was appointed because he has a reputation (whether you think it's deserved or not) for delivering attractive football on a moderate budget. They clearly want to go down so they can have a clearout, but want a firm footing on which they can rebuild from scratch. Of course, whether the SO'D model of football can actually be sustained on low/moderate budget a few years down the line is another debate, certainly he couldn't manage that here.

I don't understand why people seem to be jumping on Deano though, after all he did for us. Yeah, he took us down. We were in freefall anyway. Does anybody remember the last 8 months or so under SO'D? I certainly do. That football 'identity' that everyone bangs on about was nowhere to be seen, unless our identity was as a team who'd pass it along the back four for 20 seconds then lump it up to Sharp/Euell/Brown/Moussa etc. We were heading nowhere fast. SO'D was undoubtedly the greatest manager we had in my lifetime, but he had plenty of faults and they eventually all caught up with him at once. Deano was the right man for the job, I'm glad we went down under Saunders because nobody was keeping us up and Deano was absolutely the perfect man to take us back up again, this time stronger. He had a vision of a successful team at this level and he built that team just as well as SO'D did back in 07/08.

SO'D and Saunders are two different people with different football philosophies, neither of them gave us an 'identity' because DRFC should have it's own identity. They've both been successful in their own way, and I'm sure they have and will both fail in their own ways too. Saunders' legacy with Rovers is every bit as important as Sean O'Driscoll's.

I agree with the vast majority of that. Maybe the last bit is stretching the point a bit, simply due to the fact that Saunders wasn't here anywhere near as long as SOD, and as yet we still don't know the longer term impact of Saunders' tenure.

Having said that, last summer was massive for us. If we'd got it wrong, we could have been having a completely different season than we are now, and envisaging a completely different future, so credit has to go to Deano for turning it around under the circumstances.

Talking about 'identity' and 'building for the future' and all that. I'm not convinced that SOD's long term vision was all that realistic for Rovers. I've heard him repeatedly talk whilst he was here and since he left about the setup that clubs like Manchester United have with big backroom teams to handle everything from sports science, nutrition, performance analysis, scouting etc., and trying to replicate that. I'm just not sure that was ever scaleable at a small club like ours. Perhaps it might work at a bigger club like Forest or even Bristol City, but if you want to create a mini Manchester United, it seems to me you need the resources, and I don't think we had the resources. That's why I think Deano's approach with perhaps a more 'minimalist' backroom team (for want of a better word) was probably more realistic for us. I could be completely wrong, but that's how I see it.

[MachoMadness]

Well, I don't mean to say that Saunders did as much for Rovers as SO'D did in 6 years, I probably worded that poorly. What I mean is, Saunders achievements to get the entire squad turned round when it would have been so easy for us to freefall down the league like Pompey did deserves a lot more credit than it gets, and is comparable to SO'D getting us promoted out of L1. What Saunders did for us under any circumstances was amazing. What he did under the circumstances we had is nothing short of a miracle. Agree that last summer was massive, could've gone so wrong, but it couldn't have turned out any better given the circumstances.

Good point about the backroom stuff as well. That was probably SO'D's undoing, and when it all started to unravel with injuries he didn't have any answers.