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Quote from: Lipsy on April 09, 2017, 10:46:48 amAll Glynn did was provide you with a brief history of euroscepticism whilst we have been in the E.E.C and the EU. I appreciate that you're heavy on opinion and light on facts, but you're just plain wrong here. The bitching, carping, moaning and undermining of our participation in Europe has been constant (from politicians and press alike). There was no 'quietly getting on with it' - which I appreciate was just a dig at Remain voters. Heck, I believe Farage voted for the Green Party in 1989 because of their anti-Europe stance... So (deep breath) that's the Labour Party as whole until 84 (though some prominent figures in the party continued to moan), the Greens, vocal Tories throughout, the Anti-Federalist League that then morphed into UKIP, and the radicalising right wing press throughout we're all it - all pandering to a population that continued to moan and hate our partipation in Europe. In that brief history, Glynn implied that UKIP was formed on the back of the first referendum, it clearly was n't as it took almost 20 years for UKIP to appear, Glynn convenienlty chose to omit that fact from his brief history
All Glynn did was provide you with a brief history of euroscepticism whilst we have been in the E.E.C and the EU. I appreciate that you're heavy on opinion and light on facts, but you're just plain wrong here. The bitching, carping, moaning and undermining of our participation in Europe has been constant (from politicians and press alike). There was no 'quietly getting on with it' - which I appreciate was just a dig at Remain voters. Heck, I believe Farage voted for the Green Party in 1989 because of their anti-Europe stance... So (deep breath) that's the Labour Party as whole until 84 (though some prominent figures in the party continued to moan), the Greens, vocal Tories throughout, the Anti-Federalist League that then morphed into UKIP, and the radicalising right wing press throughout we're all it - all pandering to a population that continued to moan and hate our partipation in Europe.
Quote from: Filo on April 09, 2017, 11:04:39 amQuote from: Lipsy on April 09, 2017, 10:46:48 amAll Glynn did was provide you with a brief history of euroscepticism whilst we have been in the E.E.C and the EU. I appreciate that you're heavy on opinion and light on facts, but you're just plain wrong here. The bitching, carping, moaning and undermining of our participation in Europe has been constant (from politicians and press alike). There was no 'quietly getting on with it' - which I appreciate was just a dig at Remain voters. Heck, I believe Farage voted for the Green Party in 1989 because of their anti-Europe stance... So (deep breath) that's the Labour Party as whole until 84 (though some prominent figures in the party continued to moan), the Greens, vocal Tories throughout, the Anti-Federalist League that then morphed into UKIP, and the radicalising right wing press throughout we're all it - all pandering to a population that continued to moan and hate our partipation in Europe. In that brief history, Glynn implied that UKIP was formed on the back of the first referendum, it clearly was n't as it took almost 20 years for UKIP to appear, Glynn convenienlty chose to omit that fact from his brief historyNo I didn't imply anything. It was a bald statement that an anti-Europe political party was formed after the 1975 referendum, which is true and why I sad it. You made the implication in your own head because you wanted to quibble about a timescale that is irrelevant to what I originally said.
Certain papers moaned. Certain senior Tories moaned and sometimes the man in the street moaned.Generally most members of the public just got on with it.Views seemed more polarised from the mid to late 90s onwards in my opinion for what it's worth.
Quote from: idler on April 09, 2017, 08:38:42 pmCertain papers moaned. Certain senior Tories moaned and sometimes the man in the street moaned.Generally most members of the public just got on with it.Views seemed more polarised from the mid to late 90s onwards in my opinion for what it's worth.When things changed/were changing exactly idler, but that doesn't suit some who's views think that everybody who voted leave is a muppet and believed bullshite and the remainers were never fed bullshite and everything that was said on the remain side was so whiter than white
Quote from: Dagenham Rover on April 09, 2017, 08:54:07 pmQuote from: idler on April 09, 2017, 08:38:42 pmCertain papers moaned. Certain senior Tories moaned and sometimes the man in the street moaned.Generally most members of the public just got on with it.Views seemed more polarised from the mid to late 90s onwards in my opinion for what it's worth.When things changed/were changing exactly idler, but that doesn't suit some who's views think that everybody who voted leave is a muppet and believed bullshite and the remainers were never fed bullshite and everything that was said on the remain side was so whiter than white And thats the problem on this thread, too many pople that think they know it all, and prepared to belittle anyone else that does n't hold the same views
Quote from: idler on April 07, 2017, 09:38:20 amI voted in that time.I voted to be part of a group of trading nations not a federal Europe as it seems to be heading now.I actually have some sympathy for this point of view. Though I have watched the interviews with Ted Heath from the early 70s, which seem to suggest he was pretty clear where Europe was heading and was prepared to commit to that. Similarly, Churchill knew where it was going back in the late 40s and early 50s when he played his part in setting it up and was still up for it enough when he backed our failed attempt at joining in the 60s.How joining and remaining was sold to the people of the UK back in the in the 60s and 70s is another matter entirely, but key figures in its formation and taking us in seemed pretty clear.
I voted in that time.I voted to be part of a group of trading nations not a federal Europe as it seems to be heading now.