Keegan

[Glyn_Wigley]

Just like people around me slagging Bennett off for every little thing.

But they're not the ones pretending it's 'banter'

[Norfolk N Chance]

Abuse, er you tore him apart on here yesterday and by what I gather from this thread you did the same at Deepdale.

So am I not entitled to an opinion?

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

[RedJ]

Abuse, er you tore him apart on here yesterday and by what I gather from this thread you did the same at Deepdale.

So am I not entitled to an opinion?

Did I say you weren't? I only yesterday pointed out the inconsistencies in your opinions though.

[Norfolk N Chance]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

Abuse? What you talking about?

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

Abuse? What you talking about?

I'm asking what you think is the dividing line between banter and abuse. Simple enough question.

[Norfolk N Chance]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

Abuse? What you talking about?

I'm asking what you think is the dividing line between banter and abuse. Simple enough question.

You keep saying abuse.

I stand accused of pointing out Keegans faults yes....

Abuse is entirely different...

[Glyn_Wigley]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

Abuse? What you talking about?

I'm asking what you think is the dividing line between banter and abuse. Simple enough question.

You keep saying abuse.

I stand accused of pointing out Keegans faults yes....

Abuse is entirely different...

I'm sure that's what you think but what I want to know is when - in your opinion - does it stop being banter and become abuse? What's the tipping point as far as you're concerned?

[Norfolk N Chance]

Yeah, what's your opinion on the difference between banter and abuse?

Abuse? What you talking about?

I'm asking what you think is the dividing line between banter and abuse. Simple enough question.

You keep saying abuse.

I stand accused of pointing out Keegans faults yes....

Abuse is entirely different...

I'm sure that's what you think but what I want to know is when - in your opinion - does it stop being banter and become abuse? What's the tipping point as far as you're concerned?

My points and based on what I see...

Purely football and not personal...

That is my opinion.

I have pointed the limitations out and also underlinning the reasons for my displeasure this afternoon.

However, to be fair after this he got better.

[Glyn_Wigley]

So you're refusing to answer the question? I'm not surprised.

I really hate it when people who berate players (or abuse other people on a forum) hide behind the figleaf of 'it was just banter'. That's why whenever I see somebody use that pathetic defence I ask them for their definition of what the difference between 'banter' and 'abuse' is. Surprise, surprise, I've never received an answer yet. You've just joined the list.

[Alickismyhero]

I  found two definitions from the Urban Dictionary which may be of interest.

Abuse,
 is the improper usage or treatment for a bad purpose, often to unfairly or improperly gain benefit. Abuse can come in many forms, such as: physical or verbal.


Banter,
Supple term used to describe activities or chat that is playful, intelligent and original. Something you either posses or lack, there is no middle ground. It is also something inherently English, stemming as it does from traditional hi-jinks and tomfoolery of British yesteryear.

"You, sir, are drunk"

"Maybe so but you are ugly and I will be sober in the morning"

"Good banter sir"

Perhaps a good example of abuse is when you see an opposition  player taking taking a corner at the home end on TV. If you record the comments and actions of so called football supporters that is clearly abuse yet we all put up with it.

Clearly one mans Banter is another mans Abuse. If the banter is geared to hurt and destroy an individual it is bullying and not banter.

[Wellred]

I  found two definitions from the Urban Dictionary which may be of interest.

Abuse,
 is the improper usage or treatment for a bad purpose, often to unfairly or improperly gain benefit. Abuse can come in many forms, such as: physical or verbal.


Banter,
Supple term used to describe activities or chat that is playful, intelligent and original. Something you either posses or lack, there is no middle ground. It is also something inherently English, stemming as it does from traditional hi-jinks and tomfoolery of British yesteryear.

"You, sir, are drunk"

"Maybe so but you are ugly and I will be sober in the morning"

"Good banter sir"

Perhaps a good example of abuse is when you see an opposition  player taking taking a corner at the home end on TV. If you record the comments and actions of so called football supporters that is clearly abuse yet we all put up with it.

Clearly one mans Banter is another mans Abuse. If the banter is geared to hurt and destroy an individual it is bullying and not banter.

In other words Norfolk. You are an idiot.  Oh and you can take that as banter if you wish.

[nice one rovers]

I was stood near you Norfolk, all you did was hound keegan for every little thing he did. He was decent today.

If you call having banter hounding.

I've never understood why our own"fans" bother to turn up at a game home or away, and heckle the team they are supposed to be SUPPORTING. It really spoils the enjoyment of everyone around you. Its ok to think what you're thinking, but you shouldn't be mouthing those thoughts at your own team while they're playing. Go watch wrestling, or a crap comedian if you want to pay to heckle. Banter, my arse!

[Alickismyhero]

I don't know how many of you go back to the Harry Gregg days but on one occasion Harry was subject to Banter/abuse from our supporters and he was so angry he turned around and offered to take them on with his fists. Harry had a bit of a temper and was one of the best keepers in the   world but still took stick at Donny. Nothing new there then!

[Donnybax]

I think that's a little unfair every fan will have had a go at a player at some point, its what we do when we think they could have done better or something different. And Norfolk was not abusing keegan it's just clear he doesn't like him and picked up every little thing he did wrong. We all have those players that we think should be doing better.

[benaldo]

Like someone once said "football is as close to a participation sport as you can get.....". I guess that hurling abuse at players on the pitch counts as "Participation"?

In my opinion, a football forum is never going to be populated with the intellectual glitterati of the population, so you just have to accept the beast for what it is and who it attracts - me included.

God knows I've made my fair share of "comments from the heart" or, as A Ferguson would put it "being demonstrative", but I think there's a difference between calling someone crap and issuing a death threat (not saying anyone here has, of course). Personal abuse just for the sake of it is wrong, especially if it is designed for that person to see and with the intention of upsetting them, but comments on someones performance as a footballer, I think, are fair game.

[Rios]

It's my opinion that Keegan was superb yesterday.  Got away with the fouls in the first twenty minutes, but it was Keegan still running and making the tackles in the 93rd minute with the same vigour and force as he was in the first 30 seconds when some of the rest of the team were dead on their feet.  He's limited, but I'd rather have him in our team as a midfield enforcer who then passes the ball onto Cotterill, etc than have Clingan or the likes of John Oster in the team.  How many seasons in the Championship were we moaning that we got bullied out of games by being too lightweight in the middle?  Now we have a spine of Jones, Keegan and Paynter who aren't going to be bullied by anyone and some of you still aren't happy!

And if you were anywhere near as smart as you think you are Norfolk you'd realise that its Keegan's strengths that allow our inconsistent flair players (that'll be Bennett especially!) to get so many opportunites to get forward and use the ball instead of having to spend the majority of the game chasing back like they had to last season.  Keegan is an essential cog in the team and the fact that you can't see that says more about you than the lads lack of technique or ability on the ball.

[RedJ]

Speaking of which, Cotts (I think anyway) has been rather consistent this season. Coincidence? I think not.

[Norfolk N Chance]

I have never read so much crap in my life.

The banter was with a small group of 5 people, instigated by a guy who had a go at Oster (posh last year) and we simply had banter he would exaggerate Keegan's contribution and I would Bennet.

As I say get your facts right!

The facts were four fouls in twenty mins but after that he did ok no better than anyone else.

Sadly he is not the man to play at home as we are too sluggish with him driving it forward at home not to say he will not be an important squad player.

[uptonson]

I jus wish you would go back to Norfolk.  You are such a knob picking on Keegan who can probably play better football than you when is laid in bed.

Did you not see his run and cut back near the end of the match, beating three players and only the long leg of the Preston defender stopped pointer scoring.

Our midfield is getting better and will Keegan will be capped by Ireland.  We all have opinions so keeps your to yourself.

[RedJ]

  not sure Ireland will come calling but he is improving, and isn't that bad anyway.

[uptonson]

not sure Ireland will come calling but he is improving, and isn't that bad anyway.

Just an opinion which Mr Norfolk thinks is OK.  Keegan is too old to get his first cap but if Norfolk can abuse Keegan I can hope Ireland will call.

[RedJ]

Oh you're never too old, ask Zamora. I hope they do come along even if I doubt it, another international for the Rovers

[eastender]

 Opinions, i'm a big Keegan fan and don't try to hide the fact. I'll take 100% commitment over skill evry time .
Oster is a skillfull player , but a lazy player  ,  and where is he now, Barnet , say's it all  #timetocallitadayjonny #pinchingaliving

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Strewth ! You still going at it you two?

Whether we like it or not, Keegan is an important part of Saunder's team and no matter how much we debate the merits of him, clearly Deano sees him as a 'stopper' who'll keep going no matter what.

He's doing a decent job in this league and you can't say he's a slacker can you?

[IDM]

In one game at BV, a bloke stood behind me on the pop side was giving Lewis Guy some stick every time he went near the ball.  Now we all know that Lewis wasn't our best player by a long way, but this was in the early days and the young lad was trying his best.  Eventually, when the abuse continued just after Lewis had put in a 70 yard sprint to chase down a ball, I turned round and politely suggested his opinion might be too extreme, I was told to "f**k off".  Then his mate, who was drunk, suggested that as this bloke had been on the pop side for 50 years his opinion must be right and dare I disagree then I risked being assaulted.  I still see that bloke at the KM sometimes, and I am glad I am able to restrain myself.

Now, back to the thread, is Keegan better or worse than Guy?  Does Keegan contribute more to the team?  I believe he does, every team needs grafters.  So what if he makes a few fouls - I would expect that of a player in his position, getting stuck in!  Let the other 10 in the team be the flair players?

[Norfolk N Chance]

I jus wish you would go back to Norfolk.  You are such a knob picking on Keegan who can probably play better football than you when is laid in bed.

Did you not see his run and cut back near the end of the match, beating three players and only the long leg of the Preston defender stopped pointer scoring.

Our midfield is getting better and will Keegan will be capped by Ireland.  We all have opinions so keeps your to yourself.

now thats abuse

[uptonson]

But true.