C John

[Donnywolf]

Here's his twitter apology, shouldn't be needed;

https://twitter.com/CameronJohn_/status/1229038684328079367

 
More positivity on there than on here!

No lets face it - these things happen. OK its in the public eye and they were taking to p** on Sky as they would have done irresective of the Player / Team involved but he should have no need to Tweet an apology

I scored an absolute bullet header once v Louis Jones dad who himself was an incedibly good keeper. He never saw it. The only problem was I was the Centre Back in his Team. I boobed by heading it back to him when he was on the edge of the area waiting to catch it and secondly I boobed because it was right in the top right corner so if he had been on his line it was unstoppable

Me a poor Sunday League player was mortified - I was gutted at my stupidity - and said so when I did it - but it bugged me forever so CJ with 2 will be probably more miffed but needs no apology from him

Wonder if that Crewe bloke in Reply #86 above has taken to Twitter becasue missing that chance is at least as bad as 2 OGs

[Bentley Bullet]

I don't see all the fuss. Shit happens. I scored an own goal once but I did the honest and sensible thing........ and blamed the goalkeeper. It was his job to save it, after all.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

Makes you wonder how Harry McGuire stays on with VAR evidence of a boot to the gonads and Fejiri gets an early bath. If only Chelsea had Evans and Raynor on the sidelines!

[BillyStubbsTears]

Gaz. What did you see coming?

I'll say again. Neither of the two own goals were anything to do with him playing full back.

Him costing us a game. The second one was.

He made mistakes that any defender in any position could have made in those conditions.

I disagree. The second one resulted from him moving in to cover from the left back position. His body shape was all wrong and he could have even been in the position he needed to be earlier. It’s completely different circumstances to being a centre half.

If he'd have been in the position you say he should have been, who would have been providing cover to the No8 striding into the box with no-one within 15 yards of him?

John was left covering both him and the right winger. He took up a position that gave him a chance of covering either depending on where the cross went. But the exact trajectory of the cross took it into the one place that he had to lunge goalward for it to intercept it.

Had John taken up a position 2-3 yards deeper as you seem to suggest he should have done, what cover would we have had if the cross had been pulled back to the penalty spot?

[dickos1]

The number 8 would’ve been someone else problem, you can’t start trying to do everyone else’s job.

[Draytonian III]

I was never much as footballer when I was younger but I did once play in a junior school regional cup final, I usually played on the left wing because I could run fairly fast even ( you wouldn’t think so to see me now 🍻🍻 ) even though I’m right footed. When we play the final the usual right fullback isn’t there so I’m drafted in, mainly I think it’s because my big mate is on the right wing , bit like Jimmy O’Connor and Copps . We take the lead then I scored right in the postage stamp from corner of the box , trouble is my cousin is in goal . All my school are on the sidelines ,teachers, pupils also same with opposition and host schools, numerous parents, grandparents, siblings, friends ,the local press etc . They all seemed to start laughing as one , not that it’s ever haunted or bothered me for the last 45 years  !!! And we lost the final.

[BillyStubbsTears]

The number 8 would’ve been someone else problem, you can’t start trying to do everyone else’s job.

Go on. Whose problem? Given that everyone else had left him.

Go and look at the video.

Some defender who says "I'll ignore that player running into the box unmarked as the cross comes over - not my problem."

You play percentages. John did. And the cross landed in the one position that would screw up that decision.

It happens. That doesn't make him a shit left back.

[pib]

Billy - aside from the own goals, do you think, from what you have seen watching him, that he's comfortable playing left back?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Pib.

That's a totally different question to the one I was addressing.

Is he the best left back in the club?
Clearly not.

Is he a better left back than centre half?
Clearly not.

Is he adequate cover at left back?
Unless you expect us to have two Reece Jameses in the squad, yes.

[pib]

Pib.

That's a totally different question to the one I was addressing.

Is he the best left back in the club?
Clearly not.

Is he a better left back than centre half?
Clearly not.

Is he adequate cover at left back?
Unless you expect us to have two Reece Jameses in the squad, yes.

That's why I asked it separately.

Granted at the moment we haven't got much choice, I accept that, but DM has picked him frequently since Christmas and had RJ sat on the bench, which seems a very strange managerial decision to me. I guess that's why I'm not a football manager.

I've not seen much of Amos but I would be interested to see how he'd fare there.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Before James's injury, there were four games in which he was dropped and John played left back, and one in which John played left back and James played left-midfield.

Peterborough (A)
Sunderland (H & A)
Tranmere (A)
Fleetwood (A)

That seems to suggest that Moore was choosing John in matches, primarily against strong sides away from home.

Our return in those five games was W2 D1 L2 which is far from disastrous, given that four of the five were against automatic promotion/play-off contenders and four of the five were away.

I agree, I also thought the selection decisions were strange, but as I say, the results weren't bad. Remember that Cameron John never once started at full back in the side whose away league record up to Xmas was
P7 W1 D3 L3.

[dickos1]

The number 8 would’ve been someone else problem, you can’t start trying to do everyone else’s job.

Go on. Whose problem? Given that everyone else had left him.

Go and look at the video.

Some defender who says "I'll ignore that player running into the box unmarked as the cross comes over - not my problem."

You play percentages. John did. And the cross landed in the one position that would screw up that decision.

It happens. That doesn't make him a shit left back.

Where John was he would’ve got nowhere near the number 8 had it been pulled back to him, he’s miles away from him.
He’s stood in no mans land, and the point is a player that’s playing with confidence wouldn’t have swung his leg at it like that in a panic.
The lack of confidence he’s currently got from being played out of position contributed massively to that own goal

[BillyStubbsTears]

You're talking nonsense. Had the cross been pulled back in the direction of the number 8, there would have been time for John to move towards him and look to make a block.

Yes, if the cross had been pinged in at pace directly and precisely at the No8 and he'd been able to make an immediate clean contact, John would have had no chance of getting to him. But that's a low probability event and it's silly to make judgements on that.

John had been left exposed. With the position that he took up, he had a chance of defending against either the winger or the number 8. In both cases there was a chance that the ball would drop into positions that would have made it hard for him to defend (which is what happened) but that doesn't mean he positioned himself badly.

You and Gaz are saying, with hindsight, that he made an error in not positioning himself where the ball finally landed. I'm saying, when he chose that position, he had no idea where the ball was going to land and he took up a perfectly sensible place.

If the cross had skimmed off Akinde's head and landed 8 yards out, and the number 8 had run onto it and lashed it home with John inside the six yard box and only covering the winger, I GUARANTEE you there would have been howls that he was showing his inexperience and not being aware of the danger the number 8 was presenting.

[dickos1]

I’m not talking nonsense at all.
It’s all right writing all this if the ball had gone there or if the ball had gone there this would have happened it’s all rubbish.
If you’ve ever played the game you’d know the goal was an error because he found himself in no mans land and panicked and snatched at the ball.

A player with confidence wouldnt have done that

[BillyStubbsTears]

You are talking absolute nonsense in saying a) that John should have ignored the No8 and b) that John couldn't have done anything about the No8 had the ball gone towards him.

You say, with hindsight, that it is "rubbish" to talk about where the ball might have gone. But in the moments before and as the cross came over, there were at least 4 dangerous possibilities.

1) The totally unmarked No 8 might have been picked out by the cross.
2) The ball might have been flicked on by Akinde towards the centre of the box, for the unmarked No 8.
3) Akinde might have got an effort on goal.
4) The ball might have gone where it went, towards the right winger.

John was the only defender deeper than the near post and was the only line if defence against all of those possibilities. You're criticising him for not choosing to take up a position that would have prioritised one of those possible outcomes and ignoring the other 3.

[NickDRFC]

I used to think that the threads where the budget was endlessly debated were the worst but I think these forensic analyses of goals that we concede are probably even worse...

[dickos1]

I used to think that the threads where the budget was endlessly debated were the worst but I think these forensic analyses of goals that we concede are probably even worse...

I agree

The only fact is John snatched at the ball when he didn’t need to.
He’s a very good player, but he’s lacking confidence and this for me is down to being played out of position

[Bentley Bullet]

Can we all stop trying to have the last word on the subject?

Let's put the lid on it now and make this the last comment.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

I used to think that the threads where the budget was endlessly debated were the worst but I think these forensic analyses of goals that we concede are probably even worse...

I agree

The only fact is John snatched at the ball when he didn’t need to.
He’s a very good player, but he’s lacking confidence and this for me is down to being played out of position

So you keep saying. Just as you were suggesting John was being preferred to James as part of his loan agreement.

Rightly or wrongly, DM is the man with the responsibility of picking the team and clearly has sufficient confidence in John to do the job he's tasked with. There's no evidence to suggest John was low on confidence before the Gillingham game and given James unfortunate injury, I don't think most would hesitate to play John at left back.

He had a mare with own goals, probably the second was maybe as a result of the first. In that very position earlier in the season, we've seen him tidy up things without problems.

Maybe now, DM will have to check on John to assess whether he should continue at left back or whether he needs a rest.

To assume John's performance and own goals were directly as a result of him being low on confidence due to him being played out of position is just guesswork.not fact.

He needs our support as a young player with a bright future.

Soz BB, already started my post

[Bentley Bullet]

OK DBR, no prob!

[dickos1]

I used to think that the threads where the budget was endlessly debated were the worst but I think these forensic analyses of goals that we concede are probably even worse...

I agree

The only fact is John snatched at the ball when he didn’t need to.
He’s a very good player, but he’s lacking confidence and this for me is down to being played out of position

So you keep saying. Just as you were suggesting John was being preferred to James as part of his loan agreement.

Rightly or wrongly, DM is the man with the responsibility of picking the team and clearly has sufficient confidence in John to do the job he's tasked with. There's no evidence to suggest John was low on confidence before the Gillingham game and given James unfortunate injury, I don't think most would hesitate to play John at left back.

He had a mare with own goals, probably the second was maybe as a result of the first. In that very position earlier in the season, we've seen him tidy up things without problems.

Maybe now, DM will have to check on John to assess whether he should continue at left back or whether he needs a rest.

To assume John's performance and own goals were directly as a result of him being low on confidence due to him being played out of position is just guesswork.not fact.

He needs our support as a young player with a bright future.

Soz BB, already started my post

I didn’t say it was fact I said for me it’s down to a lack of confidence due to being out of position, never said it was fact.
And I also said it makes you wonder if it was part of his loan agreement, never suggested it was.

I think there’s plenty of evidence that he’s not suited to playing left back and has been suffering from a lack of confidence for a couple of months.

Anyhow just clearing up a couple of your incorrect points.