Marquis rejects offer

[ravenrover]

Just a thought, a whisper in the ear from Millwall?

[RoversAlias]

My god that meme is so old, I bet the kid in the image is about 12 now 

Made me laugh though. This thread hasn't been as erratic as I expected when I went on Twitter and saw the news.

My thoughts, since this news has made me look slightly stupid for insisting all week that there's nothing to suggest he might leave, is that both the player and the club need to make a decision now. He either stays and signs an extension or we sell him whilst we can still get a bit of money for him. Fergie isn't stupid, he knows that he needs Marquis or a player in Marquis' mold. He's said today that he is happy with the five strikers he has, and that this rejection doesn't mean Marquis is leaving. If he's that confident, then maybe there's nothing to worry about but the longer this drags on, the worse it'll get especially for Marquis, since fans will soon turn on a player seen to be holding the club to ransom.

RA, you were suggesting that anyone who thought there could be any issue with the contract had got it wrong.

Correct I did, and now I am proven wrong instead. I maintain that the panic over no information was over-the-top, but obviously I can't still claim I'm right when it's come out today that he turned down a new deal.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Early negotiations clearly.  3 scenarios.

1. He wants to leave, we sell him, hopefully get a decent fee and replace him.  He's not irreplaceable and not proven at this level by a long way.

2.  Further negotiations and he signs, probably with certain clauses etc which are probably the sticking point.

3.  Neither happens, he stays plays well and goes for nothing at the end of the year - or he may not perform and we actually don't want to keep him....

The football club doesn't really lose IMO, I don't think he's that vital to the team though clearly a good player he still has an awful lot to prove.  Equally I'm intrigued as to how he kicks on. 

It's weird, I'd be tempted to sell him now given he may well fail at this level, we shouldn't forget that.  Greg Blundell got 20 goals in our 3rd division season and couldn't make that next step for example.  The quality gap is there, though Marquis is younger and much better technically I would say.  If I was Ferguson and a decent bid came in I'd be tempted, very tempted.  It's money you could use to strengthen more than just one player.

If I was Marquis?  Well I would be looking to stay, but would I sign right now?  Probably not.  I'd be looking at the hope of a bigger offer from both Rovers and other clubs.  Footballers get short careers and you can't blame him for waiting and seeing what happens.  If someone does want him now he may never get the chance again to move on.  Equally, if nobody wants him or he moves to a club that it doesn't work out his career could go down the pan compared to staying here.

After all those comments I suspect he'll stay and sign a contract with a few clauses within it that suit all parties. I can't see another club taking the gamble right now and I can't see why he'd take the risk and want to leave.

[drfchound]

BFYP, a good and sensible summing up.
Players come and go but it is us (fans) and the club that stay for the long ride.

[Jonathan]

Early negotiations clearly.  3 scenarios.

1. He wants to leave, we sell him, hopefully get a decent fee and replace him.  He's not irreplaceable and not proven at this level by a long way.

2.  Further negotiations and he signs, probably with certain clauses etc which are probably the sticking point.

3.  Neither happens, he stays plays well and goes for nothing at the end of the year - or he may not perform and we actually don't want to keep him....

The football club doesn't really lose IMO, I don't think he's that vital to the team though clearly a good player he still has an awful lot to prove.  Equally I'm intrigued as to how he kicks on. 

It's weird, I'd be tempted to sell him now given he may well fail at this level, we shouldn't forget that.  Greg Blundell got 20 goals in our 3rd division season and couldn't make that next step for example.  The quality gap is there, though Marquis is younger and much better technically I would say.  If I was Ferguson and a decent bid came in I'd be tempted, very tempted.  It's money you could use to strengthen more than just one player.

If I was Marquis?  Well I would be looking to stay, but would I sign right now?  Probably not.  I'd be looking at the hope of a bigger offer from both Rovers and other clubs.  Footballers get short careers and you can't blame him for waiting and seeing what happens.  If someone does want him now he may never get the chance again to move on.  Equally, if nobody wants him or he moves to a club that it doesn't work out his career could go down the pan compared to staying here.

After all those comments I suspect he'll stay and sign a contract with a few clauses within it that suit all parties. I can't see another club taking the gamble right now and I can't see why he'd take the risk and want to leave.

Agree with most of that except for the fact that personally I feel Blundell showed that he could make the step up. I might be wrong here but I think he still top scored for us (with double figures?) and brought a lot more besides that to the team in the season after we won the league. If Marquis hits double figures for us this season I'd consider that something of a success.

Edit - I think Blundell only got 9 that season but I would still say he brought enough to the team to show he was good enough for that level. Albeit I know the goal return emphasises that it was a step up for both him and the team.

[steve@dcfd]

BFYP if he is not proven at League 1 then how can we replace him with somebody who is, when we will have to pay a transfer fee and wages.
A league one proven striker will cost equivalent in wages plus a transfer fee on top.

Therefore the supporters who believe we can bring in better must believe we are going to get a good fee for John ( non proven league 1 striker)?

[Jonathan]

Marquis may not be proven at League One level yet, but let's put it another way; if he played for another club and we were signing him we'd be over the moon given his strike rate last season. It goes without saying that we have to hope he stays and commits to us. However, whilst we should be prepared to offer a good contract that reflects his standing as the top scorer, we can't be held completely to ransome. Hopefully there'll be a meeting in the middle. In the mean time he's under contract at his current rate of pay so should stay and play on that until it expires or a new deal can be agreed.

[Glyn_Wigley]

Huh? When is early enough, then Gazlaz?  An offer has been made half way through his current contract with a year left to go.  Are you suggesting that we should offer players a contract now and then another one every few months?

As soon as you realise his stock/price is increasing tie him down. The fact he will now likely leave in a cut price deal or for free shows there has been mismanagement somewhere along the line.

It was obvious by January he'd been a better signing than his initial 2 year deal implied.

And he can just as easily refuse to be tied down and there's bugger all the club can do about it. How would that be mismanagement?

[rich1471]

Who in they right mind accepts the first offer I think he will sign a new deal but if the monies right then sell him

[grayx]

Who in they right mind accepts the first offer I think he will sign a new deal but if the monies right then sell him

I'd be surprised if this was the "first offer" though given how long this seems to have been taking. Wonder if a compromise deal will include a release clause if a bigger club comes in for him.

[PDX_Rover]

I expect him to sign a 12 month extension. It's not unusual for the first contract offer to be rejected is it? If he doesn't sign, then fair enough. He loves playing for Rovers and under a manager who is getting him firing and improving his game. So why not stay on and see where it leads...?

[Susan Abbott]

Who in they right mind accepts the first offer I think he will sign a new deal but if the monies right then sell him

I'd be surprised if this was the "first offer" though given how long this seems to have been taking. Wonder if a compromise deal will include a release clause if a bigger club comes in for him.

I'm getting fed up now , my threat to cancel my S/T worked a treat tho , but it's about time i started looking forward to May & Kiwomya ripping into defences.

[Alan Southstand]

I'll go along with that PDX, except I would have given him 2 more years, thereby ensuring that if he does have a good season then the bidding clubs will have to pay mega bucks.

Marquis has been quoted as saying he doesn't want to leave, as his game has come on in leaps and bounds and he is learning from the manager. Good news all round. All we have to do is get somewhere near his expectations and what possible reason is there for not doing so? Like Jon says, if it was us that was signing him now, we'd be over the moon!

[RoversAlias]

Who in they right mind accepts the first offer I think he will sign a new deal but if the monies right then sell him

I'd be surprised if this was the "first offer" though given how long this seems to have been taking. Wonder if a compromise deal will include a release clause if a bigger club comes in for him.

I'm getting fed up now , my threat to cancel my S/T worked a treat tho , but it's about time i started looking forward to May & Kiwomya ripping into defences.

You should already be looking forward to that Sue!

[roversontheup]

Just MHO but I think there is far too much hysteria about this. People are making 2+2=7. 
Just because JM has rejected the offer(s) made to him doesn't mean he wants to leave. I would be amazed if discussions aren't ongoing until either an improved contract is agreed or an impasse is reached and we all carry on as we are for a period if time. None of us knows what discussions are taking place behind the scenes so it really is pointless taking wild guesses that are probably very wide of the mark.

[George Carter]

It needs sorting out asap so we can get a replacement in if we need to.

[Alan Southstand]

Or whilst we still have some bargaining power.

[Chris Black come back]

I feel duty bound to say that like nigh on all the rest of them, he was proper dog shit in the last half dozen matches when we threw the title away.

Tbf he was astounding for large parts of the season but let us not forget that utter horror show of the final few games when our 25 goal striker ended up playing 10m behind where Houghton had spent most of the season, contributing absolutely bugger all.

[Alan Southstand]

Why are people looking at the negatives when it's very clear that the positives far outweigh the negatives. Get it sorted.

[steve@dcfd]

For the supporters who believe John Marquis is not good enough for league 1 or proper dog shit. Then shame on all of you like Jonathan said if we signed a 26 goal striker from a league 2 club we would all be happy.

If John goes the way you are talking about him how much do you think the club would get, when some of our own supporters believe he's not up to league1. It  will have to be enough to bring in a proven league 1 striker whose transfer fee and wages will be as much if not more.

So I hope John stays, I hope the John and the club come to an agreement and he proves the doubters may I say negative views wrong, because let's not forget we can't afford better on our budget.

[roversontheup]

If John had shown any inclination to leave then I agree it needs to be sorted asap. But...and it's a big but.....only he and the club know if that's the case. Hysteria is taking over on here. DF and GB know the true position and we have to put our trust in them to do the best for Rovers whilst we  take a few chill pills and enjoy the sunshine, cricket, tennis and look forward to the start of a new and exciting season.
IMHO......I think we will sort out a deal with John but quite possibly not for a few months.

[DaveDRFC]

Why would anyone want to leave Donny??

http://metro.co.uk/2017/07/01/the-11-best-towns-and-cities-in-the-uk-for-financial-stability-and-a-stress-free-life-6748207/amp/

[silent majority]

For the supporters who believe John Marquis is not good enough for league 1 or proper dog shit. Then shame on all of you like Jonathan said if we signed a 26 goal striker from a league 2 club we would all be happy.

If John goes the way you are talking about him how much do you think the club would get, when some of our own supporters believe he's not up to league1. It  will have to be enough to bring in a proven league 1 striker whose transfer fee and wages will be as much if not more.

So I hope John stays, I hope the John and the club come to an agreement and he proves the doubters may I say negative views wrong, because let's not forget we can't afford better on our budget.

A question for you Steve. How big is our budget and why can't we afford better?

A further question could well be how much has JM asked for?

[mrfrostsdad]

This has been going on for months. DF expected him to sign ages ago and he hasn't.
The thing is: he had done sweet FA before he came here and is completely unproven in League 1. If he doesn't want to stay then he can bugger off as far as I'm concerned. Let's get some dosh for him while we can. Presumably we can get someone else in if we sell him?
We have Williams, Mandeville, May and the kid from Chelsea plus whoever else comes in.

I hope he stays and gets another 26 goals next season, but somehow I doubt it. We don't want anyone here who doesn't want to be here, so I wouldn't let him play his contract out and then get nothing for him personally

[RedJ]

People just deciding he's said he doesn't want to stay despite the fact that he's not once said he wants to go.

[roversdude]

For the supporters who believe John Marquis is not good enough for league 1 or proper dog shit. Then shame on all of you like Jonathan said if we signed a 26 goal striker from a league 2 club we would all be happy.

If John goes the way you are talking about him how much do you think the club would get, when some of our own supporters believe he's not up to league1. It  will have to be enough to bring in a proven league 1 striker whose transfer fee and wages will be as much if not more.

So I hope John stays, I hope the John and the club come to an agreement and he proves the doubters may I say negative views wrong, because let's not forget we can't afford better on our budget.

A question for you Steve. How big is our budget and why can't we afford better?

A further question could well be how much has JM asked for?

And to add to that how much do you think he should be paid/is worth

[steve@dcfd]

For the supporters who believe John Marquis is not good enough for league 1 or proper dog shit. Then shame on all of you like Jonathan said if we signed a 26 goal striker from a league 2 club we would all be happy.

If John goes the way you are talking about him how much do you think the club would get, when some of our own supporters believe he's not up to league1. It  will have to be enough to bring in a proven league 1 striker whose transfer fee and wages will be as much if not more.

So I hope John stays, I hope the John and the club come to an agreement and he proves the doubters may I say negative views wrong, because let's not forget we can't afford better on our budget.

A question for you Steve. How big is our budget and why can't we afford better?

A further question could well be how much has JM asked for?

I have no idea what our budget is but I'm looking at the facts from what was said by DF and GB in two different articles. We had signed Mason then it was said we need 5 more players and we did not have to sell the Five transferred listed players first.

Now we have signed Andrews and Kiwomya and loaned Whiteman.
From that point we needed according to DF a central defender and midfield player. When some of the five transfer listed players had been moved on he was aiming for two or three more.
So we missed out on 2/3 strikers because money was an issue on some if not all there fore for the money we had we kept Andy Williams(no problem with that).
In the latest interview it says that potentially we will sign a central defender so that's changed from a priority. We are still waiting for midfield player on loan and maybe Houghton.

So the budget does not appear to have been big enough looking at the business we have not done.

Looking at John again I've no idea but as I understand it we are still in negotiations with him, so we can't be far away.
If you want me to guess then I would say 8,000 a week which is on the level we are paying our highest wage earner in League 1.
But we have to pay that and more for a proven league 1 striker.

Rovers dude I would pay him at least that knowing what we would have to pay for a better striker.

Now the VSC big gun as been sent out you can report back.

[roversontheup]

I really hope you are joking! If JM seriously expects us to pay £8k a week then he is hopefully in cloud cuckoo land. At the moment he has had one great season so IMHO is worth nowhere near that. If the club paid that amount to an unproven striker at this level then we are back on a very slippery slope.

[DonnyNoel]

For the supporters who believe John Marquis is not good enough for league 1 or proper dog shit. Then shame on all of you like Jonathan said if we signed a 26 goal striker from a league 2 club we would all be happy.

If John goes the way you are talking about him how much do you think the club would get, when some of our own supporters believe he's not up to league1. It  will have to be enough to bring in a proven league 1 striker whose transfer fee and wages will be as much if not more.

So I hope John stays, I hope the John and the club come to an agreement and he proves the doubters may I say negative views wrong, because let's not forget we can't afford better on our budget.

A question for you Steve. How big is our budget and why can't we afford better?

A further question could well be how much has JM asked for?

I have no idea what our budget is but I'm looking at the facts from what was said by DF and GB in two different articles. We had signed Mason then it was said we need 5 more players and we did not have to sell the Five transferred listed players first.

Now we have signed Andrews and Kiwomya and loaned Whiteman.
From that point we needed according to DF a central defender and midfield player. When some of the five transfer listed players had been moved on he was aiming for two or three more.
So we missed out on 2/3 strikers because money was an issue on some if not all there fore for the money we had we kept Andy Williams(no problem with that).
In the latest interview it says that potentially we will sign a central defender so that's changed from a priority. We are still waiting for midfield player on loan and maybe Houghton.

So the budget does not appear to have been big enough looking at the business we have not done.

Looking at John again I've no idea but as I understand it we are still in negotiations with him, so we can't be far away.
If you want me to guess then I would say 8,000 a week which is on the level we are paying our highest wage earner in League 1.
But we have to pay that and more for a proven league 1 striker.

Rovers dude I would pay him at least that knowing what we would have to pay for a better striker.

Now the VSC big gun as been sent out you can report back.

Ignoring figures (factual or speculative) the fact JM has turned down a contract for me throws no light on the issue of how big our budget is and whether it's big enough. This phrase "obviously our budget isn't good/big enough" is starting to irk a bit. We may comfortably be able to afford what JM wants but don't feel he's worth it.

[steve@dcfd]

Noel you could be right about JM contract. But we have not yet signed other players we wanted and as been reported we missed out. So again we might have a large budget but deciding we'll only spend it on the players we want.

 The last time we were in League 1 wages and salaries was about 4 m I believe,  so large part of that will be player budget. Under today's salary and wages requirements it might be larger, I don't know.