Football Heaven

[godlike1]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

the problem is SM that there is no clear evidence of this. If it was not for your relationship with the club and understanding of the finances you would surely see where a lot of people are coming from. You need to try and put yourselves in our shoes sometimes, yes we can be a bloody impatient, frustrating and ungrateful lot but.......................there is nothing to suggest that there has been any investment in the squad this year to put a promotion push together by any stretch. At least last year they obviously pushed the out to keep John and brought potential promising youngsters in who we could look to buy and progress for our own benefit due to giving them a chance.

I just see none of that this season and no real strategy at all on the recruitment front.

[Alan Southstand]

Just a point on Taylor (SM, move on now), imho, he was the best player on the park in that 2nd half v Sheff U! It's not saying a lot, as we seemed to go backwards after ht, but I saw a massive improvement in him from the Frickley game, when he looked like someone with 2 left feet. He is to be applauded for that, at least. And, further, the manager has explained that he is still probably 10 days training away from being 100%. Well guys, I have to say, I 'd take that.

If you looked at Danny Andrew, similarly to Taylor, there was an improvement in him from the Grimsby game, so one or two are progressing.

My problem is with that central 3 and get someone like the Sheff U lad, who ran the show in that friendly, and I might just perk up a bit. If we are to stick with the manager's preferred system of 4-3-3 then we have to get the right pegs in the right holes. Christ on a bike, DF took enough of a hammering last season for the very same thing!

[scawsby steve]

    Copps, I have nothing to say that will alter Doncaster Rovers decision either way on the subject. If I shouted what I know from the rooftops it would make no difference.
   Would I sign him no,  and my opinion. do I hope it is in his past and he does well for us if he does come here, of course I do, and that is as much as you or anyone else needs to know.

Sorry Brian, but you're sounding way off the mark here. How on earth could you, or anyone else, know the circumstances of the personal issues that caused Taylor to leave Bradford?. Even Idler, who is well clued up about what's going on at Bradford, hasn't commented.

There's no way Taylor's family or Bradford City would divulge that kind of information.

[silent majority]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

Do they still put £2m in SM? Doesn’t that contravene the new financial sustainability rules? Also don’t wages now have to be a certain percentage of turn over? If so where does the additional 2m go?

Yes, they did last season. And discussions around this seasons budget would also include that level of funding.

It doesn't contravene any existing controls. SCMP states that a wage cap of 60% of turnover applies in LG1. However not much of this applies as the funding and turnover figures are applied at Club Doncaster level and not at DRFC level.

So are you saying the £2m is put into Club Doncaster and the wage bill is 60% of that figure? I still thought clubs could no longer be bankrolled in that way any more.

Yep you're right, the wrong way around. But my point is that having Club Doncaster enables the club to file accounts with the EFL that means we can pay substantially more in salaries without having to worry about the 60% cap. Its about flexibility.

[mpc123]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

the problem is SM that there is no clear evidence of this. If it was not for your relationship with the club and understanding of the finances you would surely see where a lot of people are coming from. You need to try and put yourselves in our shoes sometimes, yes we can be a bloody impatient, frustrating and ungrateful lot but.......................there is nothing to suggest that there has been any investment in the squad this year to put a promotion push together by any stretch. At least last year they obviously pushed the out to keep John and brought potential promising youngsters in who we could look to buy and progress for our own benefit due to giving them a chance.

I just see none of that this season and no real strategy at all on the recruitment front.

Its not hard to work out and SM goes round repeating himself half of the time, it's like he posts something on here and people forget it 2 days later.

If they put in 2 million every year there is no way from last year we have saved 2 million, so therefore even just a small thought would say investment has gone in and SM must have repeated time and time again about the budget being raised this year.

[silent majority]

I’d be happy with signing Taylor,
But it would mean we’re starting this season with a significantly lower wage bill than we ended last season.
Regardless of what anyone says, that’s a fact

You have a very simplistic view of the budget though. You look at the playing squad, do a quick mental calculation of what you think they are earning and arrive at your decision. Your confusing spend so far with budget!

It's obvious that the start of one season cannot be compared to the end of the other. Part of the budget has to be kept back to cover a whole host of possibilities that could, and do occur during the season. That in itself must be allowed for and calculated, that's why they call it a budget!!

[GazLaz]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

Do they still put £2m in SM? Doesn’t that contravene the new financial sustainability rules? Also don’t wages now have to be a certain percentage of turn over? If so where does the additional 2m go?

Yes, they did last season. And discussions around this seasons budget would also include that level of funding.

It doesn't contravene any existing controls. SCMP states that a wage cap of 60% of turnover applies in LG1. However not much of this applies as the funding and turnover figures are applied at Club Doncaster level and not at DRFC level.

So are you saying the £2m is put into Club Doncaster and the wage bill is 60% of that figure? I still thought clubs could no longer be bankrolled in that way any more.

Yep you're right, the wrong way around. But my point is that having Club Doncaster enables the club to file accounts with the EFL that means we can pay substantially more in salaries without having to worry about the 60% cap. Its about flexibility.

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

Do they still put £2m in SM? Doesn’t that contravene the new financial sustainability rules? Also don’t wages now have to be a certain percentage of turn over? If so where does the additional 2m go?

Yes, they did last season. And discussions around this seasons budget would also include that level of funding.

It doesn't contravene any existing controls. SCMP states that a wage cap of 60% of turnover applies in LG1. However not much of this applies as the funding and turnover figures are applied at Club Doncaster level and not at DRFC level.

So are you saying the £2m is put into Club Doncaster and the wage bill is 60% of that figure? I still thought clubs could no longer be bankrolled in that way any more.

Yep you're right, the wrong way around. But my point is that having Club Doncaster enables the club to file accounts with the EFL that means we can pay substantially more in salaries without having to worry about the 60% cap. Its about flexibility.

It can’t be £2m more though can it. Putting money into a business doesn’t increase the turn over, so I still don’t understand how this allows us more freedom on the 60% rule.

[dickos1]

I’d be happy with signing Taylor,
But it would mean we’re starting this season with a significantly lower wage bill than we ended last season.
Regardless of what anyone says, that’s a fact

You have a very simplistic view of the budget though. You look at the playing squad, do a quick mental calculation of what you think they are earning and arrive at your decision. Your confusing spend so far with budget!

It's obvious that the start of one season cannot be compared to the end of the other. Part of the budget has to be kept back to cover a whole host of possibilities that could, and do occur during the season. That in itself must be allowed for and calculated, that's why they call it a budget!!

I never mentioned budget, I clearly said wage bill.
The playing squad is smaller and has less quality than it had at any point of last season, regardless of how you try and dress it up.

[dickos1]

I’d be happy with signing Taylor,
But it would mean we’re starting this season with a significantly lower wage bill than we ended last season.
Regardless of what anyone says, that’s a fact

Does it matter, if we went up and had a lesser wage bill or does it have to be through the roof to make a point, ridiculous.

Point is, we consolidated last season in order to push on this season. Yet our squad is worse than it was 12 months ago.

[mpc123]

I’d be happy with signing Taylor,
But it would mean we’re starting this season with a significantly lower wage bill than we ended last season.
Regardless of what anyone says, that’s a fact

Does it matter, if we went up and had a lesser wage bill or does it have to be through the roof to make a point, ridiculous.

Point is, we consolidated last season in order to push on this season. Yet our squad is worse than it was 12 months ago.

These same questions / statements come out every every few days.

How come you can remember last season but not the answers to the same questions / statements you give time and time again?

[mpc123]

I’d be happy with signing Taylor,
But it would mean we’re starting this season with a significantly lower wage bill than we ended last season.
Regardless of what anyone says, that’s a fact

You have a very simplistic view of the budget though. You look at the playing squad, do a quick mental calculation of what you think they are earning and arrive at your decision. Your confusing spend so far with budget!

It's obvious that the start of one season cannot be compared to the end of the other. Part of the budget has to be kept back to cover a whole host of possibilities that could, and do occur during the season. That in itself must be allowed for and calculated, that's why they call it a budget!!

I never mentioned budget, I clearly said wage bill.
The playing squad is smaller and has less quality than it had at any point of last season, regardless of how you try and dress it up.

All of the players that have left were not good enough or constantly injured, what do you want to do keep them just to have the number 1 budget in the league, you obsessed with spending big for no reason at all.

Spending big doesn't guarantee the best quality across the season, so if you can get more out of others that cost less then why not.

Plus saving the remaining budget for situations throughout the season e.g. loans, a player pops up that's worth going for in Jan etc etc , then it's all good management.

[Bristol Red Rover]

... our squad is worse than it was 12 months ago.

I disagree and would go through the comparison but haven't got the time right now. Maybe you'd like to justify that statement? Those that have left, those that have come in, those that are now fit but weren't last season, those that have matured, those that have got worse or too old.

[Donnybax]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

[Bristol Red Rover]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

Paying SM's internet connection fees for answering all the budget questions?

[Donnybax]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

Paying SM's internet connection fees for answering all the budget questions?

quite possibly 😂

[mpc123]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

Because they under performed or the manager failed to get the most out of them, or a few were injured unluckily alot of the time.

[Rovers Return]

I'm at a loss here to see how we could have brought in significant players given the timing of Fergusons departure. He obviously hadn't spent the back end of the season lining up new players to bring in and did nothing during the period of the closed season he was here to line up new players despite the budget/none budget. Nothing, zilch! No potential signings that fell through because he moved on. My thoughts and my thoughts only, he knew he was on his way pushed or shoved or left is irrelevant. There were no rumours of potential acquisitions.

In steps the new manager with a few weeks to go before the new season. He has got to cover a lot of ground before he can decide what players he needs and then source them. He is given a budget like you all set budgets!
Do you go out and spend it all in a few weeks leaving you little wriggle room for the rest of the season?
Do you assess the squad first then go out and strengthen?
As a board member do you give him all the money in one bash? Or do you give him a bit, see how he gets on? If he does well he gets a bit more!
I must admit the way the closed season developed I didn’t expect many new signings prior to the start.

[Rovers Return]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

Because they underperformed massively! I thought Ferguson was poor at best. Strange tactics, and players playing out of position. Throwing games away that we should have held.

[selby]

  With regard to Taylor in the Sheffield game, he showed one of our few moves of attacking class when he cut in and popped a cross up to the far post.
  The trouble was the forwards we had on the field at the time were stood like trees, two moves behind, wondering what was going off.

[Rovers Return]

  With regard to Taylor in the Sheffield game, he showed one of our few moves of attacking class when he cut in and popped a cross up to the far post.
  The trouble was the forwards we had on the field at the time were stood like trees, two moves behind, wondering what was going off.

Sounds like me on a Monday night on the 6 aside pitch :-)

[Donnybax]

I simply fail to see how with the team we had last season we had the 7th highest budget.

Because they underperformed massively! I thought Ferguson was poor at best. Strange tactics, and players playing out of position. Throwing games away that we should have held.

I suppose this season will show how much they underperformed. Although admittedly the tactics and positioning of players were at times questionable. But I don’t think many people would have said before last season started that we had a squad that would be challenging for the top 6. Most said they would have been happy with consolidation.

[ChrisBx]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

I'd be amazed if our budget is in the top six of this division or if there's been any increase on last year's budget.

We've lost Alcock, Baudry, Evina, Williams and Mandeville which must equate to a significant sum of money from the wage bill. We've signed Anderson, Watters, Crawford and Wilks. If the collective wages of those four plus Taylor and Vieira outweighs the five departures then we've been mugged off.

[silent majority]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

I'd be amazed if our budget is in the top six of this division or if there's been any increase on last year's budget.

We've lost Alcock, Baudry, Evina, Williams and Mandeville which must equate to a significant sum of money from the wage bill. We've signed Anderson, Watters, Crawford and Wilks. If the collective wages of those four plus Taylor and Vieira outweighs the five departures then we've been mugged off.

The only one of those who earned a significant sum was Williams (I'm having a deja vu moment!) who quite clearly wasn't utilised by DF. Those out on loan would cost the club little or nothing, therefore the overall savings amount to not that much.

It's a given that our budget was the 7th highest in the division, therefore allowing for that plus a bit more for this season puts us exactly where we need to be. Don't forget the budget has to run for the length of the season and we havn't kicked a ball in anger yet.

[selby]

  RR, I suppose it was the class popping up of the cross, and not the stood like trees that you are comparing yourself to.
  I hope so anyway.

[raggytash]

Nobody will ever find out the truth because this board can’t even spell it.... it’s obvious cutbacks have been made and the signings prove it, but they’ll never admit it due to S/t sales and sponsorship... even walking round the place feels bad, all the bins are over flowing and bushes full of litter, just small things like that show there’s no urgency or pride..

[silent majority]

We might be there come may ;-)

So how much should we spend? We have outlined a budget that is an increase on last years, which in itself was the 7th highest in the league. Is that not investment? Is that not a board throwing in an additional £2m per season so that we can spend as we are doing?

Do they still put £2m in SM? Doesn’t that contravene the new financial sustainability rules? Also don’t wages now have to be a certain percentage of turn over? If so where does the additional 2m go?

Yes, they did last season. And discussions around this seasons budget would also include that level of funding.

It doesn't contravene any existing controls. SCMP states that a wage cap of 60% of turnover applies in LG1. However not much of this applies as the funding and turnover figures are applied at Club Doncaster level and not at DRFC level.

So are you saying the £2m is put into Club Doncaster and the wage bill is 60% of that figure? I still thought clubs could no longer be bankrolled in that way any more.

Yep you're right, the wrong way around. But my point is that having Club Doncaster enables the club to file accounts with the EFL that means we can pay substantially more in salaries without having to worry about the 60% cap. Its about flexibility.

It can’t be £2m more though can it. Putting money into a business doesn’t increase the turn over, so I still don’t understand how this allows us more freedom on the 60% rule.

The £2m that is put into Club Doncaster fills the gap between what we would normally be entitled to have as a playing budget and what we currently want to run with. If we want to participate at the top of this division then that's what we have to do.

Having CD entitles us to pass the FFP with ease as to the wealth and capabilities of our current ownership model. Filing DRFC accounts with the EFL to comply with SCMP and the 60% cap is also easier due to the ability to increase/decrease costs/turnover by utilising different parts of that model as the club sees fit.

[RedJ]

Nobody will ever find out the truth because this board can’t even spell it.... it’s obvious cutbacks have been made and the signings prove it, but they’ll never admit it due to S/t sales and sponsorship... even walking round the place feels bad, all the bins are over flowing and bushes full of litter, just small things like that show there’s no urgency or pride..

f**king hell do you just copy and paste your posts into a thesaurus?

[wilts rover]

Nobody will ever find out the truth because this board can’t even spell it.... it’s obvious cutbacks have been made and the signings prove it, but they’ll never admit it due to S/t sales and sponsorship... even walking round the place feels bad, all the bins are over flowing and bushes full of litter, just small things like that show there’s no urgency or pride..

Are you suggesting that the legally audited end of year accounts the club publishes are fraudulent? Serious allegation to make.

[RedJ]

Bordering on libel...

[DonnyOsmond]

Can we get it changed so when someone posts the word "budget" it changes it to "I have a small penis" like with "Kitsons".