Reasons to be Cheerful

[Bentley Bullet]

Sweet f**king Jesus, BB is being cloned.

Thanks BST, but I'm not quite up to Jesus's eminence.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Well then go and look at police records and compare them to the headlines. And let me know when you've found one that matches the shite thesis that BB has decided to offer us tonight.

[Bentley Bullet]

But I am right aren’t I.

Yes, you are Hound. So am I!

[Herbert Anchovy]

Around 1965, there was a murder in Balby. It was the TV news headline for a week. Nowadays a murder in Doncaster might not even hit the front page of the Doncaster Free Press.

That is a fact that goes against statistics.

If that is the case then it says more about the paper than any blasé attitude to murder.

According to the Office of National Statistics, In 1967 there were 7.4 incidents of homicide per million people in England & Wales. In 2015 there were 8.9 incidents per million people. Not a huge difference.

[BillyStubbsTears]

HA.

Yeah but you're cheating bringing facts into the discussion.

[SydneyRover]

This may give an understanding for some?

Scholarpedia

False memory refers to cases in which people remember events differently from the way they happened or, in the most dramatic case, remember events that never happened at all. False memories can be very vivid and held with high confidence, and it can be difficult to convince someone that the memory in question is wrong. Psychologists have studied false memories in laboratory situations in which events are well controlled and it can be known exactly what transpired. Such experiments have uncovered a number of factors that are responsible for creating false memories. In the next few paragraphs some of these factors will be reviewed.

http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/False_memory

[Bentley Bullet]

BST, you see this is where you let yourself down. I present you with a fact, and you get all hot and bothered and start getting aggressive. Then, you have the cheek to order ME to look at records to prove me wrong! The whole point of my post is to point out that actual facts can go against statistics and you want ME to look at some f**king stats!

It's also interesting how your first thought is to compare the standards of living back then by the amount of cash we had. It seems that money is of more importance to you than it is to us tight old bas**rds who have "pulled the rope up".

I don't care what you can find statistically to prove your point, it is far, FAR more dangerous to walk down the streets of Doncaster now than it was 40 years ago.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB

You didn't present me with a "fact". You presented me with an unsubstantiated opinion.

I didn't ask you for statistics. I asked you for examples of murders that had happened and not made the headlines.

Crack on. You're doing well tonight.

[Herbert Anchovy]

Stupid facts and figures...

Dear God up above.

I'm not dealing with shite like facts! I've got my own prejudices to tell ME what's happening.

I can't believe that someone with a mind as brilliant as your's doesn't trust it above those who are quoting facts that could come from anywhere.

I'll bet that most of those who collated those facts that Herbert quoted are too young to even remember the 60s, whereas I was there.

How many times have you had a completely different take on a Rovers match than what the DFP has reported?

SS, i think that the primary point of the report was to project how people’s perceptions of a particular time period is heavily influenced by their own circumstance. Hence, people view the decade in which they were in their 20’s as ‘the best’. It was also to show that, when presented with hard facts and evidence, people are still extremely reluctant to change their view. Human nature I’d guess. Maybe the 1960’s were great for you. However that doesn’t disguise the fact that statistical assessment tells us we are now a richer, more peaceful and more tolerant society.

Richer? Then how come there are foodbanks and people sleeping in doorways? There was none of that in the 60s.

More peaceful? Have a walk round the town centre on a Friday or Saturday night.

More tolerant? Have you seen the attitude of Remainers over the last 3 years?

SS, Are you saying that your research of wondering around town is more accurate than that carried out by academic researches, utilising a number of different sources and carried out over a number of years? By the way, my OP said the comparison was between now and the 80’s and 90’s. The 60’s aren’t mentioned.

[Herbert Anchovy]

BST, you see this is where you let yourself down. I present you with a fact, and you get all hot and bothered and start getting aggressive. Then, you have the cheek to order ME to look at records to prove me wrong! The whole point of my post is to point out that actual facts can go against statistics and you want ME to look at some f**king stats!

It's also interesting how your first thought is to compare the standards of living back then by the amount of cash we had. It seems that money is of more importance to you than it is to us tight old bas**rds who have "pulled the rope up".

I don't care what you can find statistically to prove your point, it is far, FAR more dangerous to walk down the streets of Doncaster now than it was 40 years ago.

BB, What is your last paragraph based on?

[SydneyRover]

 

[Bentley Bullet]

It happens quite regularly where murders don't make the front page of the Free Press, and even less regular when they are headlined on TV.

[Bentley Bullet]

BST, you see this is where you let yourself down. I present you with a fact, and you get all hot and bothered and start getting aggressive. Then, you have the cheek to order ME to look at records to prove me wrong! The whole point of my post is to point out that actual facts can go against statistics and you want ME to look at some f**king stats!

It's also interesting how your first thought is to compare the standards of living back then by the amount of cash we had. It seems that money is of more importance to you than it is to us tight old bas**rds who have "pulled the rope up".

I don't care what you can find statistically to prove your point, it is far, FAR more dangerous to walk down the streets of Doncaster now than it was 40 years ago.

BB, What is your last paragraph based on?

Walking down the streets of Doncaster. Hearing of attacks from witnesses, and reading of them, usually in the inside pages of the Doncaster Free Press.

[Herbert Anchovy]

It happens quite regularly where murders don't make the front page of the Free Press, and even less regular when they are headlined on TV.

I’ve no reason to doubt or disbelieve you there BB, but surely that says more about the media than the numbers of murders taking place? The fact is, the murder rate now is only slightly higher than in the late 60’s and less than much of the 70’s, 80’s and 90’s.

[Bentley Bullet]

Herbert, are those stats based on the Doncaster area?

[BillyStubbsTears]

It happens quite regularly where murders don't make the front page of the Free Press, and even less regular when they are headlined on TV.

Then you'll be able to find some examples really easily.

[Bentley Bullet]

You can find them yourself, probably in the next issue of the free press, in the inside pages.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Night night BB.

[Herbert Anchovy]

The League Table shows that the Rovers are 14th. However, I saw just how shit we were on Sunday so I’m going to ignore facts and statistics and instead believe that we’re bottom of the table.

[Bentley Bullet]

What, bottom of the FA cup table?

[Bentley Bullet]

Homicide rose from 7.3 per million population in 1967 to 17.9 per million in 2003. Between then and 2016 there was a decline in homicides, from 17.9 PM to 9.9 in 2016. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/crimeandjustice/compendium/focusonviolentcrimeandsexualoffences/yearendingmarch2016/homicide

However, since then .......
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/apr/25/homicides-in-england-and-wales-hit-highest-level-in-a-decade

[BillyStubbsTears]

Right. And how many of them were in Donny and not reported by the DfP?

[Bentley Bullet]

Now, you see, this is where Scawsby is right. Your obsession with stats to manipulate an argument is rife. Some things don't have available stats for you to manipulate. Like the one you're requesting above. Like SS says, sometimes you should view the world with your eyes and think about it with your brain without relying on others to do it for you.

[tommy toes]

Well I was walking home down Poplar Road in Skellow in 1967 when two lads got out of a van and assaulted me. I was in me Percy Jackson uniform and they beat me up coz I was a grammar school kid.
I've never been attacked since so using BB's rules I can categorically state that things were much worse then than now.

[BillyStubbsTears]

BB.

Once again. I've not mentioned anything about stats on the issue of the DfP reporting murders. I've asked you to provide an example of a murder in Donny that wasn't reported in the DfP.

Clear enough? Or do you need me to explain it to you again?

[BillyStubbsTears]

TT.

Aye. Last time I got chinned was in the ginnel than ran down from Conaby to the Crags by Northcliffe School. That was 1985. I can categorically state that things were far more violent then than they have been since that specific day.

[Glyn_Wigley]

If it didn’t make the headlines then we probably wouldn’t know about it,  would we?

Somebody must know about them otherwise they wouldn't be so stupid as to go round saying that these murders don't make the headlines, would they?

[Bentley Bullet]

BST, What exactly are you asking me to do to prove that the DFP doesn't always put local murders on the front page?

[Bentley Bullet]

HA.

Yeah but you're cheating bringing facts into the discussion.

No BST, he was cheating by manipulating them to strengthen his side of the argument.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I told you last night. Get a list of recent Doncaster murders. Compare it against DfP front pages from the time of the murder.

You're so certain that murders don't get properly reported, it must be a doddle. In fact, you're SO certain, I assume you have a few specific ones in mind?