Coronavirus

[KeithMyath]

This thread, still going strong, seems to sway in different directions in terms of opinions over times. When the virus isn’t the first thing on everyone’s minds it’s largely forgotten, when the signs of another wave emerge, it’s the role of a few to use scientific reason to answer those who have a open mistrust to anyone who is dictating to us as a population, whether government self serving figures or the wider scientific community. When the wave takes hold and causes horrific consequences it goes quite on the behalf of the deniers, a few clinging onto  agendas I can’t fathom.

If the government doesn’t learn from past experiences, other than to know how to repeat them. Then the same can be said for this thread, as long as the waves of Covid variants exits the waves of users peddling their own agendas will exist.

Maybe it’s time to have 2 threads?, one for those who will put scientific reason before anything and and those who believe what ever they want to believe based on perceived lived experiences and Facebook.

[Ldr]

And another condescending kitson appears, welcome Keith

[bpoolrover]

This thread, still going strong, seems to sway in different directions in terms of opinions over times. When the virus isn’t the first thing on everyone’s minds it’s largely forgotten, when the signs of another wave emerge, it’s the role of a few to use scientific reason to answer those who have a open mistrust to anyone who is dictating to us as a population, whether government self serving figures or the wider scientific community. When the wave takes hold and causes horrific consequences it goes quite on the behalf of the deniers, a few clinging onto  agendas I can’t fathom.

If the government doesn’t learn from past experiences, other than to know how to repeat them. Then the same can be said for this thread, as long as the waves of Covid variants exits the waves of users peddling their own agendas will exist.

Maybe it’s time to have 2 threads?, one for those who will put scientific reason before anything and and those who believe what ever they want to believe based on perceived lived experiences and Facebook.

your right to a point Keith but what has happened in the past people have predicted hundred of thousands of cases and hospitals full of we opened up schools and hospitality ect, now that has not happened and was very unlikely to happen so the scientists that predicted it were wrong, this has only happened now as there is a new variant and there was not really much you could do to stop it as the whole of Europe is finding out

[BillyStubbsTears]

London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine made a modelling projection in July 2021 on the effect of the policy of opening up (what was called Step 4).

They calculated the likely number of deaths and hospital admissions between 1 July and 31 December.

"If there is a high level of mobility following the implementation of step 4, the team project 160,000 hospital admissions and 18,000 deaths."

The actual numbers so far are:
Deaths - 17,000
Admissions - 145,000.

Those were quite astonishingly accurate projections. My error in July was not to pick up on those. I know someone involved in the LSHTM team and they deserve massive credit for this guidance. 

[rich1471]

I work as a kitchen manager in Doncaster , last night was so quite but takeaways was crazy and today is very quite for a Sunday and 6 days before Christmas

[BillyStubbsTears]

This America trip by Sunak. The one where he was having meetings so important that he couldn't attend discussions with the hospitality sector about how to help them survive.

Here's a funny thing. The Treasury publishes a diary of all the Chancellor's official meetings. There is nothing in the diary about what he was doing in America and who he was meeting. Labour have written to the Treasury asking for an explanation. Watch this space.

[BillyStubbsTears]

I work as a kitchen manager in Doncaster , last night was so quite but takeaways was crazy and today is very quite for a Sunday and 6 days before Christmas

It's inevitable. People know what is coming. They are making their own decisions. The Govt MUST now step in and provide financial support for businesses and for workers who have to self isolate.

[Filo]

This America trip by Sunak. The one where he was having meetings so important that he couldn't attend discussions with the hospitality sector about how to help them survive.

Here's a funny thing. The Treasury publishes a diary of all the Chancellor's official meetings. There is nothing in the diary about what he was doing in America and who he was meeting. Labour have written to the Treasury asking for an explanation. Watch this space.

He was having meetings with US health care providers wasn’t hee, that can only mean one thing. He also happens  to own a beachside property in California where he was allegedly

[BillyStubbsTears]

Point is though Filo, it appears his meetings weren't associated with his role as Chancellor.

Which raises the question: what the f**k was he doing half a world away on what appears to be private business, rather than sorting out how to support UK businesses through a massive crisis?

[sha66y]

Now I'm no expert, as a few people on here kindly point out on a regular basis so I will ask the experts on here a quick question.

With the amount of tests done everyday and the amount of positive tests sent in everyday. How is it possible for the labs to do the genome sequencing on every test to differentiate between delta and omicron and have the results out the very next day?



Oh, and watch out for Delta and Omicron to team up to make a super varient which the boosters won't touch so you'll need a booster to boost your booster.

I’m on your page Nudga!
And if this forum is a representation of society then we are already buggered!

This is unknown territory for me , witnessing extreme gullibility from reasonably educated and what seem like well balanced people…..

There is no evidence to support the new virus being a killer of millions yet people are talking of taking the most extreme precautions……not because they must, but because they want to!

Job done, ….let the culling begin

Careful what you wish for shaggy. Although omicron may not be a problem lethality wise, the nature of coronovirus is such that we may be a few mutations away from it fizzling out. Conversely, we may only be a few mutations away from a 100% lethal variant. Of the lethality of rabies. Certain death to anyone that catches it.
This is not fiction. It is possible.

The intelligent people may be aware that omicron is not a killer, but an isolator.
London have declared a major incident today. Not because people are dying, not because the hospitals are full to busting(yet), but because thousands of front line workers are having to isolate . One third of all London fire engines are grounded currently being a good example.
There will be a House fire in London in the coming days that may not get the response  it should due to omicron. And people may die.
Similar in nhs, paramedics, ambulance drivers, police.

The house fire not being attended is due to government policy …..not the perceived threat of moronic……….people who are perfectly healthy, feel fine yet fail a test should not be isolating if by doing that they are endangering others ..ie Fire fighters!

The policies set by the supposed experts is killing people……not the supposed virus and it’s as yet defined purpose

[drfchound]

London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine made a modelling projection in July 2021 on the effect of the policy of opening up (what was called Step 4).

They calculated the likely number of deaths and hospital admissions between 1 July and 31 December.

"If there is a high level of mobility following the implementation of step 4, the team project 160,000 hospital admissions and 18,000 deaths."

The actual numbers so far are:
Deaths - 17,000
Admissions - 145,000.

Those were quite astonishingly accurate projections. My error in July was not to pick up on those. I know someone involved in the LSHTM team and they deserve massive credit for this guidance.

Don’t beat yourself up for not picking up on those figures bst.
It is easy to know stuff with the benefit of hindsight.

[normal rules]

Now I'm no expert, as a few people on here kindly point out on a regular basis so I will ask the experts on here a quick question.

With the amount of tests done everyday and the amount of positive tests sent in everyday. How is it possible for the labs to do the genome sequencing on every test to differentiate between delta and omicron and have the results out the very next day?



Oh, and watch out for Delta and Omicron to team up to make a super varient which the boosters won't touch so you'll need a booster to boost your booster.

I’m on your page Nudga!
And if this forum is a representation of society then we are already buggered!

This is unknown territory for me , witnessing extreme gullibility from reasonably educated and what seem like well balanced people…..

There is no evidence to support the new virus being a killer of millions yet people are talking of taking the most extreme precautions……not because they must, but because they want to!

Job done, ….let the culling begin

Careful what you wish for shaggy. Although omicron may not be a problem lethality wise, the nature of coronovirus is such that we may be a few mutations away from it fizzling out. Conversely, we may only be a few mutations away from a 100% lethal variant. Of the lethality of rabies. Certain death to anyone that catches it.
This is not fiction. It is possible.

The intelligent people may be aware that omicron is not a killer, but an isolator.
London have declared a major incident today. Not because people are dying, not because the hospitals are full to busting(yet), but because thousands of front line workers are having to isolate . One third of all London fire engines are grounded currently being a good example.
There will be a House fire in London in the coming days that may not get the response  it should due to omicron. And people may die.
Similar in nhs, paramedics, ambulance drivers, police.

The house fire not being attended is due to government policy …..not the perceived threat of moronic……….people who are perfectly healthy, feel fine yet fail a test should not be isolating if by doing that they are endangering others ..ie Fire fighters!

The policies set by the supposed experts is killing people……not the supposed virus and it’s as yet defined purpose

And so a truck full of firefighters attend a house fire. With elderly people in it. They have all  tested positive for covid. But in shaggys world it’s ok they go to work, because govt policy is flawed apparently.
One of them gives one of the elderly occupants covid, which they subsequently succumb to. ………..
How would a front line worker with covid give mouth to mouth to an unconscious person shaggy?
And unless you have worked on the frontline, you probably have no idea how many times this is done in the uk every day.
Police, fire brigade, paramedics, lives doctors, nurses, St. John’s ambulance staff, the list goes on.
But it’s ok for these people to go to work with covid?

[Nudga]

Or they could burn alive. What f**kin planet are you on?

[sha66y]

This thread, still going strong, seems to sway in different directions in terms of opinions over times. When the virus isn’t the first thing on everyone’s minds it’s largely forgotten, when the signs of another wave emerge, it’s the role of a few to use scientific reason to answer those who have a open mistrust to anyone who is dictating to us as a population, whether government self serving figures or the wider scientific community. When the wave takes hold and causes horrific consequences it goes quite on the behalf of the deniers, a few clinging onto  agendas I can’t fathom.

If the government doesn’t learn from past experiences, other than to know how to repeat them. Then the same can be said for this thread, as long as the waves of Covid variants exits the waves of users peddling their own agendas will exist.

Maybe it’s time to have 2 threads?, one for those who will put scientific reason before anything and and those who believe what ever they want to believe based on perceived lived experiences and Facebook.

Scientific reason ?
Lockdowns have not worked in the past, however they have contributed immensely to the rise in mental illness…………but that’s ok I guess because Covid once again has got star billing and a huge gallery to play to!

I say again..”IF THIS MORONIC WAS HAS BAD AS BEING TOUTED, WE WOULD BE IN LOCKDOWN NOW,!!……..not after Xmas is over”

The very idea that an extremely virulent virus has decided not to rip through society during our festivities and Christmas parties beggars belief…..

I was at the Mount Pleasant Xmas dinner last night along with hundreds of others and the only masks being worn were by the serving staff……

[sha66y]

Now I'm no expert, as a few people on here kindly point out on a regular basis so I will ask the experts on here a quick question.

With the amount of tests done everyday and the amount of positive tests sent in everyday. How is it possible for the labs to do the genome sequencing on every test to differentiate between delta and omicron and have the results out the very next day?



Oh, and watch out for Delta and Omicron to team up to make a super varient which the boosters won't touch so you'll need a booster to boost your booster.

I’m on your page Nudga!
And if this forum is a representation of society then we are already buggered!

This is unknown territory for me , witnessing extreme gullibility from reasonably educated and what seem like well balanced people…..

There is no evidence to support the new virus being a killer of millions yet people are talking of taking the most extreme precautions……not because they must, but because they want to!

Job done, ….let the culling begin

Careful what you wish for shaggy. Although omicron may not be a problem lethality wise, the nature of coronovirus is such that we may be a few mutations away from it fizzling out. Conversely, we may only be a few mutations away from a 100% lethal variant. Of the lethality of rabies. Certain death to anyone that catches it.
This is not fiction. It is possible.

The intelligent people may be aware that omicron is not a killer, but an isolator.
London have declared a major incident today. Not because people are dying, not because the hospitals are full to busting(yet), but because thousands of front line workers are having to isolate . One third of all London fire engines are grounded currently being a good example.
There will be a House fire in London in the coming days that may not get the response  it should due to omicron. And people may die.
Similar in nhs, paramedics, ambulance drivers, police.

The house fire not being attended is due to government policy …..not the perceived threat of moronic……….people who are perfectly healthy, feel fine yet fail a test should not be isolating if by doing that they are endangering others ..ie Fire fighters!

The policies set by the supposed experts is killing people……not the supposed virus and it’s as yet defined purpose

And so a truck full of firefighters attend a house fire. With elderly people in it. They have all  tested positive for covid. But in shaggys world it’s ok they go to work, because govt policy is flawed apparently.
One of them gives one of the elderly occupants covid, which they subsequently succumb to. ………..
How would a front line worker with covid give mouth to mouth to an unconscious person shaggy?
And unless you have worked on the frontline, you probably have no idea how many times this is done in the uk every day.
Police, fire brigade, paramedics, lives doctors, nurses, St. John’s ambulance staff, the list goes on.
But it’s ok for these people to go to work with covid?

You wrote that and I am proud of you !

I personally think that you used the wrong example, so here’s another:

A childrens home with 30 children and 8 staff is ablaze, ……… I’m not sure I need to say any more….because your firefighters didn’t turn up…..

[i_ateallthepies]

Lockdowns have not worked in the past

You've stated this twice in the last few days and is total and absolute bollox.  Just take a look at any graph showing infection numbers aligned with lockdowns and explain to us the pattern you see.

[rich1471]

I work as a kitchen manager in Doncaster , last night was so quite but takeaways was crazy and today is very quite for a Sunday and 6 days before Christmas

It's inevitable. People know what is coming. They are making their own decisions. The Govt MUST now step in and provide financial support for businesses and for workers who have to self isolate.

we have had 4 staff members all off with COVID this week 3 with Omicron and had to send one to go get a test today as he looked terrible

[wilts rover]

This thread, still going strong, seems to sway in different directions in terms of opinions over times. When the virus isn’t the first thing on everyone’s minds it’s largely forgotten, when the signs of another wave emerge, it’s the role of a few to use scientific reason to answer those who have a open mistrust to anyone who is dictating to us as a population, whether government self serving figures or the wider scientific community. When the wave takes hold and causes horrific consequences it goes quite on the behalf of the deniers, a few clinging onto  agendas I can’t fathom.

If the government doesn’t learn from past experiences, other than to know how to repeat them. Then the same can be said for this thread, as long as the waves of Covid variants exits the waves of users peddling their own agendas will exist.

Maybe it’s time to have 2 threads?, one for those who will put scientific reason before anything and and those who believe what ever they want to believe based on perceived lived experiences and Facebook.

There were actually two threads running for a time as Nudga began his theories on a separate one. It's up to people to post where and what they think is relevant, so long as they are courteous and don't mind having their ideas/theories shot down it doesn't bother me.

[normal rules]

Now I'm no expert, as a few people on here kindly point out on a regular basis so I will ask the experts on here a quick question.

With the amount of tests done everyday and the amount of positive tests sent in everyday. How is it possible for the labs to do the genome sequencing on every test to differentiate between delta and omicron and have the results out the very next day?



Oh, and watch out for Delta and Omicron to team up to make a super varient which the boosters won't touch so you'll need a booster to boost your booster.

I’m on your page Nudga!
And if this forum is a representation of society then we are already buggered!

This is unknown territory for me , witnessing extreme gullibility from reasonably educated and what seem like well balanced people…..

There is no evidence to support the new virus being a killer of millions yet people are talking of taking the most extreme precautions……not because they must, but because they want to!

Job done, ….let the culling begin

Careful what you wish for shaggy. Although omicron may not be a problem lethality wise, the nature of coronovirus is such that we may be a few mutations away from it fizzling out. Conversely, we may only be a few mutations away from a 100% lethal variant. Of the lethality of rabies. Certain death to anyone that catches it.
This is not fiction. It is possible.

The intelligent people may be aware that omicron is not a killer, but an isolator.
London have declared a major incident today. Not because people are dying, not because the hospitals are full to busting(yet), but because thousands of front line workers are having to isolate . One third of all London fire engines are grounded currently being a good example.
There will be a House fire in London in the coming days that may not get the response  it should due to omicron. And people may die.
Similar in nhs, paramedics, ambulance drivers, police.

The house fire not being attended is due to government policy …..not the perceived threat of moronic……….people who are perfectly healthy, feel fine yet fail a test should not be isolating if by doing that they are endangering others ..ie Fire fighters!

The policies set by the supposed experts is killing people……not the supposed virus and it’s as yet defined purpose

And so a truck full of firefighters attend a house fire. With elderly people in it. They have all  tested positive for covid. But in shaggys world it’s ok they go to work, because govt policy is flawed apparently.
One of them gives one of the elderly occupants covid, which they subsequently succumb to. ………..
How would a front line worker with covid give mouth to mouth to an unconscious person shaggy?
And unless you have worked on the frontline, you probably have no idea how many times this is done in the uk every day.
Police, fire brigade, paramedics, lives doctors, nurses, St. John’s ambulance staff, the list goes on.
But it’s ok for these people to go to work with covid?

You wrote that and I am proud of you !

I personally think that you used the wrong example, so here’s another:

A childrens home with 30 children and 8 staff is ablaze, ……… I’m not sure I need to say any more….because your firefighters didn’t turn up…..

The firefighters would be at work if they had not been to the Xmas party.

[tyke1962]

Here's some interesting facts surrounding the Omricon variant .

The Dr who first identified this strain a South African Dr Coates has always maintained its only 28% of the strength of Delta .

So far only one person in the UK has died of the new variant and he was over 70 years of age and unvaccinated .

We were told the variant doubles every two days , it doesn't it actually fell yesterday according to the information I have .

The wave of hospitaliation's is interesting too I have it that 80 people in the entire UK were admitted to hospital yesterday with the new strain .

I smell a rat .

[normal rules]

7 confirmed omicron deaths.

[tyke1962]

7 confirmed omicron deaths.

Please don't think I'm some kind of covid denier or even a conspiracy theorist because I'm not .

My nature is to question rather than simply accept what I'm told and it's nothing more than that .

Again and without wanting to sound heartless and cold because 7 deaths is 7 deaths too many and are someone's loved ones .

But let's dig deeper with these figures , age , underlying health issues and jabbed up for example .

I don't think it's unreasonable to question things in this day and age that's where I'm at .

I heard today on the BBC this strain 3 times referred to by the reporter as terrifying .

That got my attention straight away given who runs the BBC today .

I still smell a rat .

[wilts rover]

Tyke - then why are you not questioning the difference between South Africa and the UK?

For a start its summer in South Africa and we know covid is less effective and contagious in summer. Then the average age in South Africa is lower than in the UK, so are these patients younger and generally healthier?

According to government figures there were 12000 cases reported today, taking total upto 37000 - on that doubling every two days number.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-12-19/12000-new-omicron-cases-reported-in-uk-as-record-number-of-booster-jabs-given

Put your figures and sources up and then we can question them - until then you appear to be simply accepting what you want to hear.

[DonnyBazR0ver]

As usual, there's scientific information coming out from studied in South Africa and around the world...and then there's the media who seem to pick and choose what they report.

The science seems to be suggesting Omicron is 70 times more infectious than Delta but far less damaging to the lungs with it mainly reproducing in the upper bronchial tract. The vast majority of mild infections last just a few days.

However, the studies concur that with the vastly higher numbers of infections, it will inevitably lead to more hospitalisations, particularly those who are unvacvinated or already vulnerable. 

It's the speed of the spread that is the problem which will cause the spike and the consequences of keeping people from work including all essential services and the subsequent fall out from that.

The advice from these studies is be prepared to catch it. Get vaccinated if not already, top up vitamin c levels etc and be sensible with lifestyle and contacts etc.

One wonders given the nature of this strain that a 10 day isolation period is too long and a way to reduce the knock on effects is to test after 7 days until negative?

A short firebreak might buy some time so could be a compulsory 2 week Christmas holidays for many of us.

https://youtu.be/84XMFVcLScw

[wilts rover]

Good article here on the South Africa studies and why it may/may not be the same in the rest of the world (article looks at the US).

It may be mild, we all hope its going to be mild, but its too early to tell

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/12/17/1065315661/omicron-may-be-less-severe-in-south-africa-that-may-not-be-the-case-for-the-u-s

[normal rules]

Il divo star Carlos Marín sadly passed away today following a short battle with covid. He was 53. RIP

[roversdude]

Il divo star Carlos Marín sadly passed away today following a short battle with covid. He was 53. RIP

Sorry where does it say he died of covid, the reports I’ve seen state - “his cause of death nor the nature of his illness has yet been revealed” regardless of his cause of death RIP

[BVB]

One from the right and one from the not so right, though not all reports are saying it explicitly as these:
https://www.express.co.uk/celebrity-news/1538526/Carlos-Marin-dead-death-Il-Divo-covid-battle-hospital-cause-today-illness-news-latest/amp

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/il-divo-carlos-marin-covid-b1979081.html?amp

[roversdude]

Thanks wasn’t questioning it I’d only seen one report

[sha66y]

Tyke - then why are you not questioning the difference between South Africa and the UK?

For a start its summer in South Africa and we know covid is less effective and contagious in summer. Then the average age in South Africa is lower than in the UK, so are these patients younger and generally healthier?

According to government figures there were 12000 cases reported today, taking total upto 37000 - on that doubling every two days number.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-12-19/12000-new-omicron-cases-reported-in-uk-as-record-number-of-booster-jabs-given

Put your figures and sources up and then we can question them - until then you appear to be simply accepting what you want to hear.

This last sentence is not without its bias, the only gig in town is the government sponsored one….so any and all balanced views and research data are being withheld !