How bad have we become?

[BillyStubbsTears]

Summed up in two sets of numbers.

1) In the past 55 games, we have won 38 points. In the 55 games before that, we had won 100 points.

2) In the 63 years since the regional Div 3s were abolished, there have been 1512 club-seasons in the national Tier 3. Only 8 of those have resulted in goal differences of worse than -50. Only 4 of those have occurred in the past 55 years. Our GD  with 14 games to go is currently -41. If it continues at the season average, it'll end up at -59. If it carries on deteriorating at the rate it has since the turn of the year, it'll end up at -62, which has only ever been beaten at this level by Accrington Stanley as they were steaming out of business.

GD matters because it says something about the resilience and organisation of the side. Poor seasons come to everyone. Rarely does that result in regular surrenders to batterings. That only happens when you have lost your pride and your will to fight. Which is where we are now. We are unquestionably among the 1% least professional, most poorly managed showers of shite to have graced this division since Harold Mac-f**king-millan was Prime Minister.

[normal rules]

Now we have Marquis to look forward to.

[Chris Black come back]

It is under any measure, an absolutely appalling 12 months. The same problems persist, oddly regardless of who the manager is or who the players are. It’s terrible but a total mystery why this has endured for so long.

The only potential explanation is that mediocrity or worse, failure has been normalised within the club. I can’t imagine that is true, but the cause is a genuine mystery. We are absolutely risible.

[German Rover]

Terrible. At least we have next season to look forward to can't be any worse

[BillyStubbsTears]

Another figure.

With a third of the season still to go, we have conceded 4 or more goals 5 times in league games. With a third of the season still to go in 97/98, the worst side in Football League history had only conceded 4+ on 2 more occasions than this.

[Chris Black come back]

I do wonder as well that if we continue falling apart at this rate, whether McSheffrey is going to be trusted to get us out of League Two next season. We need to get straight out of there at the first attempt, otherwise you can see us getting stuck. Some of our better players may countenance one season in League Two, but beyond that, no chance. He’s no doubt been dealt a dreadful hand, but the jury is still out on McSheffrey and next season is extremely important.

[glosterred]

Sadly I don’t see anything in the players we have that will be with us next season anything other than a mid table team at best.


COYR

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

I'm not worried about GM getting us straight back up as i'm not expecting us to go straight back up if he's in charge and i don't think anyone else should either. He's not good enough for us. The real worry is if GM will continue this downturn and we end up in a scrap for our football league status.

We only need to take a look down the A18 to see just how easy and quickly this can become a reality once apathy sets in.

Sticking with McSheffrey will affect ST sales in the summer and also keep the air of concern that is hanging around the club swirling around for a bit longer. A bad start to L2 and that air of concern will quickly turn blue from the fans. Is it worth continuing with a manager who after 3 months has shown us barely a glimmer of ability?

[normal rules]

Sadly I don’t see anything in the players we have that will be with us next season anything other than a mid table team at best.


COYR

I have concerns that this seasons headache will roll into next. We have seen it before. I’d take mid table next season right now.
We could easily do a notts county or Scunthorpe.
Been there before of course.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Of all the players that GM has brought to the club in attacking, only one has scored. Reo has scored 1 goal. Bloody Horton is more dangerous than the players he's brought in! Whilst our defence has always been dodgy, i at least expected a lot more from an offensive perspective from the players brought in to score goals and create them.

Arguably we have got worse defensively despite the additions of Younger and Jackson and Mitchell and we've not improved at the other end either with only Griffiths of the new additions managing to score.

Begs the question, not how bad have we become but why?

Answers on a postcard please to

Gary McSheffrey
DRFC Mis-manager
EcoPower (we certainly are!  ) Stadium
Donny

[GazLaz]

Sadly I don’t see anything in the players we have that will be with us next season anything other than a mid table team at best.


COYR

I have concerns that this seasons headache will roll into next. We have seen it before. I’d take mid table next season right now.
We could easily do a notts county or Scunthorpe.
Been there before of course.

If people think we are run badly they should look at Scunny. They can’t even afford GPS units for the players.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

As long as they've all got football boots. GPS units shouldn't really matter.

[anton123]

Sadly I don’t see anything in the players we have that will be with us next season anything other than a mid table team at best.


COYR

I have concerns that this seasons headache will roll into next. We have seen it before. I’d take mid table next season right now.
We could easily do a notts county or Scunthorpe.
Been there before of course.

If people think we are run badly they should look at Scunny. They can’t even afford GPS units for the players.

Why the hell would we be comparing are self to a team bottom of lg2 is this how bad it’s become

[BigH]

It is under any measure, an absolutely appalling 12 months. The same problems persist, oddly regardless of who the manager is or who the players are. It’s terrible but a total mystery why this has endured for so long.

The only potential explanation is that mediocrity or worse, failure has been normalised within the club. I can’t imagine that is true, but the cause is a genuine mystery. We are absolutely risible.

I'm starting to think that the club has been culpable of institutional failure. We're well past the point of it being the fault of any single individual.

A common link to the last twelve months has been the appointment of rookie managers. Why? Has there been an unconscious bias among the Board to want a certain type of individual? Someone who they can control, who isn't egotistical and who won't kick off and make life difficult for them? I don't know but there seems to have been an avoidance of appointing or seeking out anyone with significant managerial experience.

I won't criticise Bramall because he's put his money where his mouth is, but I now think that the other Board members don't have enough football savvy to know what it takes to make the right appointment, to go out and appoint a big personality who can lead, be a dominating presence and command the players' attention. An authority figure who the younger guys will look up to and who the older guys will respect. I'm loathe to suggest further managerial upheaval but we need a leader in there somewhere because right now this is what the club are lacking.

[Branton Red]

72 clubs in the football league. Rovers have: -

- lost more games than anyone else (22; next worst 19 Crewe, Peterborough, Barnsley)
- conceded more goals than anyone else (63; next worse 61 Morecambe)
- the worst goal difference (-41; next worse -37 Peterborough)
- the second worst goals per game record after Barnsley.

This on a mid-table budget.

The other team mentioned above all have amongst the smallest budgets in their respective divisions and on that basis would be expected to struggle.

Pound for pound, relative to divisional status, we are categorically the worst performing team in the Football League.

We haven't become bad we've become mindbogglingly atrocious.

[Chris Black come back]

There has been a dose of bad luck certainly. I think we were probably overachieving under Moore but even so, we were handily placed for a promotion push 12 months ago before he walked out. The catastrophic injury situation is also pretty much unprecedented.

The last 12 months though, wow. Total, utter and consistent failure time and time again. There is something badly wrong here as it isn’t for want of budget. There is clearly more than enough for us to be well clear of relegation.

There just appears to be a stench of defeat hanging around that sadly appears to have become normalised. No manager seems able to turn this around.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

It is under any measure, an absolutely appalling 12 months. The same problems persist, oddly regardless of who the manager is or who the players are. It’s terrible but a total mystery why this has endured for so long.

The only potential explanation is that mediocrity or worse, failure has been normalised within the club. I can’t imagine that is true, but the cause is a genuine mystery. We are absolutely risible.

I'm starting to think that the club has been culpable of institutional failure. We're well past the point of it being the fault of any single individual.

A common link to the last three months has been the appointment of rookie managers. Why? Has there been an unconscious bias among the Board to want a certain type of individual? Someone who they can control, who isn't egotistical and who won't kick off and make life difficult for them? I don't know but there seems to have been an avoidance of appointing or seeking out anyone with significant managerial experience.

I won't criticise Bramhall because he's put his money where his mouth is, but I now think that the other Board members don't have enough football savvy to know what it takes to make the right appointment, to go out and appoint a big personality who can lead, be a dominating presence and command the players' attention. An authority figure who the younger guys will look up to and who the older guys will respect. I'm loathe to suggest further managerial upheaval but we need a leader in there somewhere because right now this is what the club are lacking.

I agree with lots of points. My argument against this would be that neither we as fans nor the board knew how crap both RW and GM would be before their appointments. Would we be reading posts like this (not having a pop at you at all btw BigH) if GM actually grabbed us by the scruff of the neck and started putting in great results and performances? Which could quite conceivably have happened.

My issue with the GM appointment is why a professional outfit run by supposed professional people would take such a huge risk of appointing a completely inexperienced manager given the magnitude of the position that we were in. Then on top of that, the mini audition from GM before being given the job full time was hardly a 'seal the deal' set of results and performances, yet they still appointed him anyway AND gave him funds to sign players, who by and large at the moment let's be honest have been rubbish.

So it is the bizarre decision making that is the issue IMO but i take your points and wouldn't say that you are wrong.

I've always said give GM until the end of the season and if results and performances have not significantly improved then cut loose and get someone else in. We've had a tough run of fixtures undoubtedly but GM needs to massively go some to warrant taking us into a fresh L2 campaign IMO and i am certain that he won't and can't achieve this improvement.

[normal rules]

I’m not on Instagram. For those that are, do any of the players put out messages for supporters?

[oggycompton]

Club Doncaster. Going really well.

[Chris Black come back]

72 clubs in the football league. Rovers have: -

- lost more games than anyone else (22; next worst 19 Crewe, Peterborough, Barnsley)
- conceded more goals than anyone else (63; next worse 61 Morecambe)
- have the worst goal difference (-41; next worse -37 Peterborough)
- have the second worst goals per game record after Barnsley.

This on a mid-table budget.

The other team mentioned above all have amongst the smallest budgets in their respective divisions and on that basis would be expected to struggle.

Pound for pound, relative to divisional status, we are categorically the worst performing team in the Football League.

We haven't become bad we've become mindbogglingly atrocious.

This is actually quite shocking.

[dickos1]

Club Doncaster. Going really well.

Hi oggy,
Surprised to see you’ve returned after a big defeat!

Have you made that donation to bowel cancer U.K. yet?

[Sammy Chung was King]

In the window we needed an experienced centre half, we got Younger, decent player but not experienced.
We needed an experienced defensive midfielder, we got one but he’s totally unfit and the manager isn’t playing him. We needed the same for goalkeeper, we got a non league back up keeper.


We’ve got some promising players, Griffiths, Martin. We just needed more know how. It still can be done but it gets more unlikely every week. Sad to see.

[Bailey Vickerage]

Although the 2nd half today we crumbled, I don’t really think the result has hampered our chances much apart from maybe morale and confidence going into the next couple of games. We could do with at least 2 points from the next 2 games imo.

If u offered me 6 points from our last 6 games (MK, Plymouth, Rotherham, Sunderland, Ipswich, pompey) then I’d have been more than happy with that and I think McSheffrey would’ve took that aswell.

We do really need to start taking our chances when we’re on top tho because it’s cost us again today. Hopefully GM gets it drilled into them by the time we play the teams around us.

[swintonrover]

There's something seriously wrong with the club. We've changed the players, we've changed the manager, we've changed the coaching staff, we've changed everything and yet this black aura permeates and destroys everything positive about the club.

Looking back, when was the last time you could say we absolutely dominated a game for 90 minutes and deservedly hammered somebody? Even under Moore we were successful despite not playing particularly well.

Even off the field, everything seems half arsed. A lot of non-playing staff have left/quit in the last 2 years. Certainly more than at any other time in my 20 years supporting the club.

The major thing I can pinpoint in the timeframe (apart from covid) is Andy Watson leaving the board. The three in boardroom have become stale and need to be refreshed. I've chatted with Gavin several times in the past and he's seemed to have had the stuffing knocked out of him in the last couple of years. He's extremely good at running Club Doncaster, but Doncaster Rovers he isn't. They need another body who understands the football, if only to break out of the spiral of sycophants pretending everything is fine while the stadium is (metaphorically) burning.

[The Beast]

In the window we needed an experienced centre half, we got Younger, decent player but not experienced.
We needed an experienced defensive midfielder, we got one but he’s totally unfit and the manager isn’t playing him. We needed the same for goalkeeper, we got a non league back up keeper.


We’ve got some promising players, Griffiths, Martin. We just needed more know how. It still can be done but it gets more unlikely every week. Sad to see.

Agreed, we needed big horrible gets like that big goon who scored in injury time today, someone like a young Peter Clarke, the only big rough lad we had we let go to Hartlepool and he’s doing alright. We’re far too lightweight all over the pitch.

[roverstillidie91]

Bogle scored again today. 2 in a row I think now

[Sammy Chung was King]

In the window we needed an experienced centre half, we got Younger, decent player but not experienced.
We needed an experienced defensive midfielder, we got one but he’s totally unfit and the manager isn’t playing him. We needed the same for goalkeeper, we got a non league back up keeper.


We’ve got some promising players, Griffiths, Martin. We just needed more know how. It still can be done but it gets more unlikely every week. Sad to see.

Agreed, we needed big horrible gets like that big goon who scored in injury time today, someone like a young Peter Clarke, the only big rough lad we had we let go to Hartlepool and he’s doing alright. We’re far too lightweight all over the pitch.

Years ago Everton stayed up with what they called their “Dogs of war!. We needed like you said, Beast. Players that would do the horrible stuff. We are too nice.

[adamtherover]

GMs record from when he started as interim manager would  no doubt get most other managers on the verge of being sacked? Why do we persist on giving them more and more time to fail to make things right?

[colincramb]

It’s nothing short of embarrassment. That’s all it is now. Anybody who argues otherwise is just making excuses to save face. The attitude shown by the playing staff is totally inexcusable.

The arrogance shown by blunt to supporters that dared challenge the situation at the meet the owners event sums up the general apathy around the club. A firm acceptance to blame only injuries on our situation over the last 12 months, not owning any poor decisions they might have made. The culture of excuses has just dripped through from the top down like a toxic waste. The culture at the club is shocking

[steve@dcfd]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.