How bad have we become?

[keith79]

We are way to easy to play against.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.

Everyone has to start somewhere but for the club to set on GM after a poor interim spell in charge and given the perilous situation we were in was insanity. No hindsight actually required. You just don't do it.

There is no guarantee that an experienced manager would have done any better of course. Take Keith Hill at Scunny, however, you play the odds and make the most rational decision appropriate to the situation. Which the board failed to do.

Had we appointed say Paul Cook and still been like we are now, then at least the board could have turned around and said 'well we went for a safe and experienced pair of hands and backed him with signings, so what more do you want?'

But as it is, they made such a reckless and nonsensical gamble and now fans have the ammo to aim their fully loaded weapons at the board. Rightly so in the case of the irrational appointment of GM.

Suicidal decision and our relegation was cemented when they offered him the contract.

[colincramb]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.

Everyone has to start somewhere but for the club to set on GM after a poor interim spell in charge and given the perilous situation we were in was insanity. No hindsight actually required. You just don't do it.

There is no guarantee that an experienced manager would have done any better of course. Take Keith Hill at Scunny, however, you play the odds and make the most rational decision appropriate to the situation. Which the board failed to do.

Had we appointed say Paul Cook and still been like we are now, then at least the board could have turned around and said 'well we went for a safe and experienced pair of hands and backed him with signings, so what more do you want?'

But as it is, they made such a reckless and nonsensical gamble and now fans have the ammo to aim their fully loaded weapons at the board. Rightly so in the case of the irrational appointment of GM.

Suicidal decision and our relegation was cemented when they offered him the contract.

Really can’t disagree with this. Pretty honest reflection if truth be told.

Mansfield signed Martty Longstaff. We signed Clayton. Enough said really

[Prez]

In the 40 years of watching rovers this has arguably with the exception of 97/98 season been the worst one. And there’s been some pretty bad ones during that time. It’s just soul destroying watching us capitulate on a regular basis.

[Canadian Rover]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.

Everyone has to start somewhere but for the club to set on GM after a poor interim spell in charge and given the perilous situation we were in was insanity. No hindsight actually required. You just don't do it.

There is no guarantee that an experienced manager would have done any better of course. Take Keith Hill at Scunny, however, you play the odds and make the most rational decision appropriate to the situation. Which the board failed to do.

Had we appointed say Paul Cook and still been like we are now, then at least the board could have turned around and said 'well we went for a safe and experienced pair of hands and backed him with signings, so what more do you want?'

But as it is, they made such a reckless and nonsensical gamble and now fans have the ammo to aim their fully loaded weapons at the board. Rightly so in the case of the irrational appointment of GM.

Suicidal decision and our relegation was cemented when they offered him the contract.

Really can’t disagree with this. Pretty honest reflection if truth be told.

Mansfield signed Martty Longstaff. We signed Clayton. Enough said really

Mansfield kept JJOT he chose them over us... that says it all.

[since-1969]

Terrible. At least we have next season to look forward to can't be any worse

Why ? Most of the players are already signed up for next season, so what makes you think anything will change . Baldwin will still be turning out his usual 5 year plans ( he must have dozens of of them printed out ) so there’s one person who will f*** it up !

[tyke1962]

You've had a debacle of a season and it indeed may well be the worst since 98 but your club isn't broken .

Nowt going on here that can't be mended and your certainly no Oldham or Scunthorpe or even Barnsley if the truth be told .

Perspective .

[GazLaz]

Getting out of a horrific run like we are in isn’t an over night thing. It’s not been a one month to the next thing. You have to bring it out and it comes with gradual improvement over a long period. It’s very unlikely to come during the schedule of games we have this month as I’ve said plenty of times. People need to think longer term.

[colincramb]

Getting out of a horrific run like we are in isn’t an over night thing. It’s not been a one month to the next thing. You have to bring it out and it comes with gradual improvement over a long period. It’s very unlikely to come during the schedule of games we have this month as I’ve said plenty of times. People need to think longer term.

That’s all well and good, Gaz. But what is the longer term plan? I’m not sure anybody at the club has one. Certainly not one that’s credible.

I’m going to edge my bets now. GM will not get us out of league 2 next season. Even with one of the bigger budgets.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.

Everyone has to start somewhere but for the club to set on GM after a poor interim spell in charge and given the perilous situation we were in was insanity. No hindsight actually required. You just don't do it.

There is no guarantee that an experienced manager would have done any better of course. Take Keith Hill at Scunny, however, you play the odds and make the most rational decision appropriate to the situation. Which the board failed to do.

Had we appointed say Paul Cook and still been like we are now, then at least the board could have turned around and said 'well we went for a safe and experienced pair of hands and backed him with signings, so what more do you want?'

But as it is, they made such a reckless and nonsensical gamble and now fans have the ammo to aim their fully loaded weapons at the board. Rightly so in the case of the irrational appointment of GM.

Suicidal decision and our relegation was cemented when they offered him the contract.

Really can’t disagree with this. Pretty honest reflection if truth be told.

Mansfield signed Martty Longstaff. We signed Clayton. Enough said really

Mansfield kept JJOT he chose them over us... that says it all.

Would you have given him a 2.5 year contract here really?  It's bloody obvious why he stayed there.

[Chris Black come back]

We are all at a loss here. 12 months ago we were firmly in the play offs. Fast forward 12 months and we are by and large the worst club in the 92 and we are four managers further on, and god knows how many players.

In fact as a sign of the turmoil in that period, of the 18 man squad in our game 12 months ago (the 4-1 mauling away at Sunderland on 13 February 2021) there is not a SINGLE player in the squad yesterday. Not in the team, not in the SQUAD. Laughably, the closest we get is the Other Matt Smith.

Nobody wants this, least of all the board, but we have I think normalised failure. The entirely accurate talk of preparing for life in League Two started in early January. Is that normal? Nothing happening at the club at present in normal. The catastrophic injury and treatment situation, the huge squad we are now carrying, total failure to physically compete for more than half an hour. This is all most definitely not normal, yet it’s become our standard. Very weird.

[rich1471]

We must be bad ,even Bogle has scored 2 in 2 games for Hartlepool

[Filo]

We must be bad ,even Bogle has scored 2 in 2 games for Hartlepool

Create chances for strikers often enough strikers will score, create chances now and then for them and they won’t score, it’s as simple as that

[selby]

  Our biggest problem is no u23s, it is causing the club problems not being able to bring in players from good levels at non league clubs between the u18s and the first team squad who have gone on to good things at other clubs and representative level, The one big decision that has cost the club big time.
  The situation is if we see a player over the age of 16 who has missed the academy intake start date because it is linked to an educational course unless they are willing like a couple of players who fortunately were on another course at Doncaster Technical College who with the Rovers combined for them to train with the group  and are willing to take their chance for nothing when all the players around them are contracted while they play for travel expenses there is no pathway for players.
  There are no part time pro's nowadays, because of travel costs no amateurs from colleges and universities because they can play non league for decent money and the reason why the standard of non league is so good especially at and near the top levels.
   So as a club, if we have not signed a player by the time they are 16 to play in our u18s team, we are consigned to bringing in players who have probably been released from other clubs and are deemed not good enough by those clubs and the leap from u18s to first team is massive very few will succeed to do as Hasani Greaves and Ravenhill are finding out.
  No u23s is the worst decision the club have made, and has been a handicap for  our last two managers and Gary McSheffrey at present.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Exeter City are geographically isolated and have to compete with Plymouth and Bristol City for the best talent in their area. They bring through young players every season, play them, improve them which improves the team and reduces the need for spending money on transfers, and generally sell them on at a profit.

Us meanwhile..............

[Daniel_Smith]

Chesterfield and Gillingham set on experienced managers yet we set on U18 coach as manager U16 coach as his assistant and the academy goal keeping coach as goal keeping coach it says it all about the club. They have backed the selection process they have backed bringing in players yet the results are no better. The club on the football field is no better.

Everyone has to start somewhere but for the club to set on GM after a poor interim spell in charge and given the perilous situation we were in was insanity. No hindsight actually required. You just don't do it.

There is no guarantee that an experienced manager would have done any better of course. Take Keith Hill at Scunny, however, you play the odds and make the most rational decision appropriate to the situation. Which the board failed to do.

Had we appointed say Paul Cook and still been like we are now, then at least the board could have turned around and said 'well we went for a safe and experienced pair of hands and backed him with signings, so what more do you want?'

But as it is, they made such a reckless and nonsensical gamble and now fans have the ammo to aim their fully loaded weapons at the board. Rightly so in the case of the irrational appointment of GM.

Suicidal decision and our relegation was cemented when they offered him the contract.

Really can’t disagree with this. Pretty honest reflection if truth be told.

Mansfield signed Martty Longstaff. We signed Clayton. Enough said really

Agreed! What's frightening is that after McSheffrey proved he wasn't quite up to it, with the couple of games he managed on an interim basis, you still had fans saying he was the best man to take the job permanently?!

[BillyStubbsTears]

Getting out of a horrific run like we are in isn’t an over night thing. It’s not been a one month to the next thing. You have to bring it out and it comes with gradual improvement over a long period. It’s very unlikely to come during the schedule of games we have this month as I’ve said plenty of times. People need to think longer term.

That’s all well and good, Gaz. But what is the longer term plan? I’m not sure anybody at the club has one. Certainly not one that’s credible.

I’m going to edge my bets now. GM will not get us out of league 2 next season. Even with one of the bigger budgets.

If we perform next season like we have for the past 12 months I will guarantee you that we get out of L2 next year.

[tyke1962]

Exeter City are geographically isolated and have to compete with Plymouth and Bristol City for the best talent in their area. They bring through young players every season, play them, improve them which improves the team and reduces the need for spending money on transfers, and generally sell them on at a profit.

Us meanwhile..............

That's probably true but in a way their geographical position means there is less competition for young talent .

Rovers are competing with ourselves , the two Sheffield clubs and  Rotherham .

That's just South Yorkshire , then there's West Yorkshire and 30 mile over the hill Manchester , Greater Manchester and the rest of Lancashire .

It ain't that easy .

[Jonathan]

Getting out of a horrific run like we are in isn’t an over night thing. It’s not been a one month to the next thing. You have to bring it out and it comes with gradual improvement over a long period. It’s very unlikely to come during the schedule of games we have this month as I’ve said plenty of times. People need to think longer term.

That’s all well and good, Gaz. But what is the longer term plan? I’m not sure anybody at the club has one. Certainly not one that’s credible.

I’m going to edge my bets now. GM will not get us out of league 2 next season. Even with one of the bigger budgets.

If we perform next season like we have for the past 12 months I will guarantee you that we get out of L2 next year.

Thankfully, as the resident inveterate optimist, I’m sure you won’t go on about it.

[big fat yorkshire pudding]

  Our biggest problem is no u23s, it is causing the club problems not being able to bring in players from good levels at non league clubs between the u18s and the first team squad who have gone on to good things at other clubs and representative level, The one big decision that has cost the club big time.
  The situation is if we see a player over the age of 16 who has missed the academy intake start date because it is linked to an educational course unless they are willing like a couple of players who fortunately were on another course at Doncaster Technical College who with the Rovers combined for them to train with the group  and are willing to take their chance for nothing when all the players around them are contracted while they play for travel expenses there is no pathway for players.
  There are no part time pro's nowadays, because of travel costs no amateurs from colleges and universities because they can play non league for decent money and the reason why the standard of non league is so good especially at and near the top levels.
   So as a club, if we have not signed a player by the time they are 16 to play in our u18s team, we are consigned to bringing in players who have probably been released from other clubs and are deemed not good enough by those clubs and the leap from u18s to first team is massive very few will succeed to do as Hasani Greaves and Ravenhill are finding out.
  No u23s is the worst decision the club have made, and has been a handicap for  our last two managers and Gary McSheffrey at present.

If your points were correct you question the point of having an academy at all - some clubs have gone that route, Huddersfield, Brentford etc. 

But I think it's more a tool to get youngsters in the area involved at playing sport than a tool for the first team.  We have had barely any successful youth team players come through so it doesn't on that view add much if any value.

Maybe it will come good but it doesn't seem likely so we should accept that fact and stop trying to push it as a goal.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

You could argue that the South West is largely a huge rural area and the talent that is there is few and far between and the bigger clubs get first dibs over Exeter.

If we aren't able to recruit, produce, develop and use young players in the first team to our benefit and then sell them on, then why do we have one in the first place? It is a waste of resources.

Take your point though about the competition in the S.Yorks area.

Another issue is our loan signings. Surely as we are so close geographically to many other larger clubs, we can take advantage of their youngsters or cast offs both from a first team loan perspective and from the perspective of adding them to our youth / reserve set ups?

For example. We signed Rodrigo Vilca from Newcastle on loan. Pile of shite. Cukur from Watford. Worse than a Cabbage Patch Doll and less mobile etc etc.

[Colin C No.3]

Getting out of a horrific run like we are in isn’t an over night thing. It’s not been a one month to the next thing. You have to bring it out and it comes with gradual improvement over a long period. It’s very unlikely to come during the schedule of games we have this month as I’ve said plenty of times. People need to think longer term.

That’s all well and good, Gaz. But what is the longer term plan? I’m not sure anybody at the club has one. Certainly not one that’s credible.

I’m going to edge my bets now. GM will not get us out of league 2 next season. Even with one of the bigger budgets.

If we perform next season like we have for the past 12 months I will guarantee you that we get out of L2 next year.

Thankfully, as the resident inveterate optimist, I’m sure you won’t go on about it.

I wouldn't count on it Jono (I get the sarcasm in your last sentence).

I'm in no doubt there are files of stats yet to be unearthed 'proving' our demise is terminal.

Whatever floats your boat.

Me?  Still believe I saw the green shoots of recovery (1st half against Pompey another step), we need to start & turn good passages of play & chances into goals, starting against Lincoln.

[Colin C No.3]

You could argue that the South West is largely a huge rural area and the talent that is there is few and far between and the bigger clubs get first dibs over Exeter.

If we aren't able to recruit, produce, develop and use young players in the first team to our benefit and then sell them on, then why do we have one in the first place? It is a waste of resources.

Take your point though about the competition in the S.Yorks area.

Another issue is our loan signings. Surely as we are so close geographically to many other larger clubs, we can take advantage of their youngsters or cast offs both from a first team loan perspective and from the perspective of adding them to our youth / reserve set ups?

For example. We signed Rodrigo Vilca from Newcastle on loan. Pile of shite. Cukur from Watford. Worse than a Cabbage Patch Doll and less mobile etc etc.

1. Vilca & Cukur are no longer with the club so they're history, why then use them as examples especially as they weren't brought to the club by the present manager?

2. We are 'competing' for young talent with the likes of Leeds, Huddersfield, Rotherham, Barnsley & the two Sheffield clubs.

3. Name me two 'cast offs' from 'larger clubs' that would enhance our youth set up.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

You could argue that the South West is largely a huge rural area and the talent that is there is few and far between and the bigger clubs get first dibs over Exeter.

If we aren't able to recruit, produce, develop and use young players in the first team to our benefit and then sell them on, then why do we have one in the first place? It is a waste of resources.

Take your point though about the competition in the S.Yorks area.

Another issue is our loan signings. Surely as we are so close geographically to many other larger clubs, we can take advantage of their youngsters or cast offs both from a first team loan perspective and from the perspective of adding them to our youth / reserve set ups?

For example. We signed Rodrigo Vilca from Newcastle on loan. Pile of shite. Cukur from Watford. Worse than a Cabbage Patch Doll and less mobile etc etc.

1. Vilca & Cukur are no longer with the club so they're history, why then use them as examples especially as they weren't brought to the club by the present manager?

2. We are 'competing' for young talent with the likes of Leeds, Huddersfield, Rotherham, Barnsley & the two Sheffield clubs.

3. Name me two 'cast offs' from 'larger clubs' that would enhance our youth set up.

It isn't my job to name cast offs from larger clubs. It is the job of the bloke at DRFC paid to find these players and isn't doing so.

Vilca & Cukur i have used as examples as they are from clubs that are miles away, plus they were shit. Why can't we find players more local to us? I guess that question maybe partly answered by your second point.

My answer to that would be to just scrap the reserves / youth set up as it is an unproductive and unnecessary expense that the club are not benefitting from.

I'd rather the club lowered ticket prices for loyal fans and did away with areas of the club that are providing no benefit but is costing money.

[tyke1962]

You could argue that the South West is largely a huge rural area and the talent that is there is few and far between and the bigger clubs get first dibs over Exeter.

If we aren't able to recruit, produce, develop and use young players in the first team to our benefit and then sell them on, then why do we have one in the first place? It is a waste of resources.

Take your point though about the competition in the S.Yorks area.

Another issue is our loan signings. Surely as we are so close geographically to many other larger clubs, we can take advantage of their youngsters or cast offs both from a first team loan perspective and from the perspective of adding them to our youth / reserve set ups?

For example. We signed Rodrigo Vilca from Newcastle on loan. Pile of shite. Cukur from Watford. Worse than a Cabbage Patch Doll and less mobile etc etc.

Trouble is there's loans from big clubs and there's loans .

The top notch talent from Chelsea for instance is going to cost at least a million pound loan fee .

They also come with clauses in the agreement , if they don't play 75% of games there's penalty clauses installed .

We had a similar agreement with Liverpool when we had Ryan Kent and something I didn't like at the time .

Similar with Leicester City when we had Harvey Barnes for 6 months although he was proper good to be fair .

I'm afraid the games all stitched up at youth level and you have to make the best of it .

Which isn't easy .

[steve@dcfd]

Before the game the Pompey manager had picked out our weaknesses and picked his side accordingly. Dealing with crosses where we had conceded a lot of goals. In the second half he reminded this to his players and they should play with more freedom and they did and they scored 4. GMC is apologising again in the free press he should get things right for 90mins of football. But we don’t get any apologies from the people that count for bad strategic decisions they have made in the last twelve months where our path under three managers they selected have gone downhill very quickly. That also believe quite arrogantly that if we do get relegated we can rectify the situation. I don’t share their belief. Let’s be fair Mr Brammel said the club will find its level we’ll improve afraid this could be lower than we all suspect.

[dickos1]

We must be bad ,even Bogle has scored 2 in 2 games for Hartlepool

Create chances for strikers often enough strikers will score, create chances now and then for them and they won’t score, it’s as simple as that

Not really as simple as that,
He’s playing a league down now and in 30 games or so here he’s never looked like a striker that will score goals, even when we were creating chances

[Colin C No.3]

You could argue that the South West is largely a huge rural area and the talent that is there is few and far between and the bigger clubs get first dibs over Exeter.

If we aren't able to recruit, produce, develop and use young players in the first team to our benefit and then sell them on, then why do we have one in the first place? It is a waste of resources.

Take your point though about the competition in the S.Yorks area.

Another issue is our loan signings. Surely as we are so close geographically to many other larger clubs, we can take advantage of their youngsters or cast offs both from a first team loan perspective and from the perspective of adding them to our youth / reserve set ups?

For example. We signed Rodrigo Vilca from Newcastle on loan. Pile of shite. Cukur from Watford. Worse than a Cabbage Patch Doll and less mobile etc etc.

1. Vilca & Cukur are no longer with the club so they're history, why then use them as examples especially as they weren't brought to the club by the present manager?

2. We are 'competing' for young talent with the likes of Leeds, Huddersfield, Rotherham, Barnsley & the two Sheffield clubs.

3. Name me two 'cast offs' from 'larger clubs' that would enhance our youth set up.

It isn't my job to name cast offs from larger clubs. It is the job of the bloke at DRFC paid to find these players and isn't doing so.

Vilca & Cukur i have used as examples as they are from clubs that are miles away, plus they were shit. Why can't we find players more local to us? I guess that question maybe partly answered by your second point.

My answer to that would be to just scrap the reserves / youth set up as it is an unproductive and unnecessary expense that the club are not benefitting from.

I'd rather the club lowered ticket prices for loyal fans and did away with areas of the club that are providing no benefit but is costing money.

You need to read your last two paragraphs then give yourself a good slap.

Jones, Horton, Ravenhill, Seaman are 4 players you wouldn’t have seen in a Rovers shirt if you had your way & scrapped our youth set up.

And now no doubt you’ll come back & tell me how s**t they are!

As for your final paragraph, it beggars belief.
Scrap all ‘unnecessary projects’ (unnecessary because you deem them to be!) including the reserves & youth set ups for cheaper tickets for (& this I had to read twice to believe) ‘loyal fans’!

I hope you don’t dare place yourself in that category as you ‘kick the club’ as it struggles to drag itself out of the current mire it finds itself in.

Shame on you.

[ColinDouglasHandshake]

Another gross misinterpretation of a post. Well done. 

[Colin C No.3]

Another gross misinterpretation of a post. Well done. 

Really? How so?