State pension.

[normal rules]

I hear that the govt may announce as soon as March their intention to bring forward plans to raise state pension age to 68. It was planned to happen in 2046, but may now be brought forward to 2035. That will affect anyone who is aged 54 or under today.
I see the French are protesting over Macrons change to their state pension. I hope to see the same in the uk if this goes ahead.

[Filo]

I hear that the govt may announce as soon as March their intention to bring forward plans to raise state pension age to 68. It was planned to happen in 2046, but may now be brought forward to 2035. That will affect anyone who is aged 54 or under today.
I see the French are protesting over Macrons change to their state pension. I hope to see the same in the uk if this goes ahead.

French state Pension age is 62 at the present, they want to raise it to 64, still miles better than ours

[danumdon]

I think even now many people are going to be fully dependent on the state pension so to delay it further for retirement will be a big blow to many.

Some may say that everyone should make it their business to ensure they have as comfortable a retirement as they can manage but i would imagine this will hit the ones who will need it most and happen to work in low end jobs that are physically strenuous and none pension providing, so a double whammy.

For many this is a long way away but education is the key.

[i_ateallthepies]

What is education going to do for people on national minimum wage or zero hours contracts for whom every day is a struggle just to afford to live?

[Filo]

What is education going to do for people on national minimum wage or zero hours contracts for whom every day is a struggle just to afford to live?

Zero hour contract and agency’s should be outlawed. My Son started with an agency before Christmas, he’s been at three different locations, Yesterday he went to Work at 8:15 am, to get to work for a 10am start, at 11am they finished all the agency staff, a disgraceful way to treat people, how can anyone plan a life around that

[danumdon]

What is education going to do for people on national minimum wage or zero hours contracts for whom every day is a struggle just to afford to live?

Education as in being made aware of what they require to do make sure they don't get lumbered in old age with just the state pension to live off.

Education as in if you're in a zero hours or minimum wage job then you certainly should be looking to get yourself some, because if you don't then your life is mapped out for you as in struggling now and later in life.

We know that some wont be in  a position to do so for a variety of different reasons but apathy wont pay the bills, so if someone can educate people in this position to go out and do something for themselves then this should be it.

[i_ateallthepies]

danumdon you are ignoring the question of those whose earnings aren't enough to live let alone buy a private pension.

[danumdon]

danumdon you are ignoring the question of those whose earnings aren't enough to live let alone buy a private pension.

I doubt i ignored the question, the answer is in there unless you want me to spell it out.

[ncRover]

What is the rationale for this exactly? The previous rationale if I am correct is that life expectancy was going up? It has dropped in recent years.

If it’s an attempt at cost-cutting it could backfire if a higher % of people are not in a fit state to work and taking more sick days from age-related illnesses etc.

[idler]

I would imagine there will be an ever increasing number of people in their late 60s being on the dole or invalidity benefit. How many will be riddled with arthritis, rheumatism and breathing related problems?
You certainly wouldn’t employ someone in their late 60s to do hard manual labour.
 Would benefits be cheaper than paying them the state pension?
 Is that the reason behind this train of thought?
Where would all of the extra jobs come from for this sudden influx of potential employees?

[SydneyRover]

Lots in this to think about, please try to read it all before jumping in .............

''Britain lavishes benefits on plenty of rich pensioners. Let’s means test them now''

Bumping the state pension age up to 68 will do little to help those who are so poor, they won’t even reach that age ......

..... In a country so grossly unequal, nothing is fair. As the government plans to raise the state pension age from 66 to 68 at a much earlier date than previously announced, it looks increasingly unjust to pay out the pension at the same rate and at the same age for everyone, regardless of wildly differing circumstances''

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/jan/26/britain-rich-pensioners-state-pension-age-68-poor

[BobG]

Dogma, not the needs of people, has driven decision making by the Conservative party since 1979. As its consequences become ever more stark the  Conservatives have little left to maintain them in power. The Conservative triple lock on pensions guarantees an inflation proofing 10% rise to the wealthiest age group in the nation. An age group which, coincidentally, happens to vote Conservative. But that same inflation proofing is denied to striking nurses and ambulance staff, whose pay has been squeezed. strangled and perpetually devalued for a decade. The rest of the  benefit system, paid almost entirely to the least wealthy 20% of society, has lost a fifth of its value over the 12 years of this Conservative government. Coincidentally that least wealthy 20% tends not to vote Conservative. An interesting divergence in approach between different benefits. Funny that...

BobG

[danumdon]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

[SydneyRover]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

No just do what it says in the article and means test pensions so that those wealthy ones, the ones that don't need the money don't get the money, simple.

[drfchound]

Syd, how would you draw the line at which a pensioner would be classed as being wealthy.

[selby]

  The retirement age for men in the Netherlands is 68 years old now.

[BillyStubbsTears]

Something very apt about the Baby Boomer generation getting the state pension (which is paid for by the rest of the population) at 65, then voting to pull up the ladder behind them.

[Filo]

Something very apt about the Baby Boomer generation getting the state pension (which is paid for by the rest of the population) at 65, then voting to pull up the ladder behind them.

I’m a Baby Boomer but can’t get mine till I’m 67

[danumdon]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

No just do what it says in the article and means test pensions so that those wealthy ones, the ones that don't need the money don't get the money, simple.

I don’t profess to know your situation but you are either drawing or in for some pension payments, should you be means tested?

Where do you draw the line, do we penalise someone for making prudent decisions decades aga?

[selby]

  Yep Billy, we have the returns of our fathers the best generation that this country ever had, its not our fault your lot have made a mess of it since the 1980s, buck up get going, heads down arses up and you might enjoy the fruits of your labour.
 If you carry on snorting powder, working from home, less hours, sitting on motorways and stopping people from getting to work and listening to the left loonies its going to get worse buddy.
 And by the way, if you want a good pension you need to put a lot of money in it over your working life.
 

[SydneyRover]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

No just do what it says in the article and means test pensions so that those wealthy ones, the ones that don't need the money don't get the money, simple.

I don’t profess to know your situation but you are either drawing or in for some pension payments, should you be means tested?

Where do you draw the line, do we penalise someone for making prudent decisions decades aga?

correct on first count, you don't know, and incorrect on the second I do not.

Those that are classed as wealthy which is relative of course are not being penalised, they gained their wealth in a country that has, with some exceptions, educated them with some provided with a better level of education inc facilities and teachers at no extra cost. They are given opportunities to gain further education, access to health services and protection such as it is.

Is it asking too much that those that can afford it support those that cannot? You are not being victimised for doing well you are being asked to contribute to a better society.

[danumdon]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

No just do what it says in the article and means test pensions so that those wealthy ones, the ones that don't need the money don't get the money, simple.

I don’t profess to know your situation but you are either drawing or in for some pension payments, should you be means tested?

Where do you draw the line, do we penalise someone for making prudent decisions decades aga?

correct on first count, you don't know, and incorrect on the second I do not.

Those that are classed as wealthy which is relative of course are not being penalised, they gained their wealth in a country that has, with some exceptions, educated them with some provided with a better level of education inc facilities and teachers at no extra cost. They are given opportunities to gain further education, access to health services and protection such as it is.

Is it asking too much that those that can afford it support those that cannot? You are not being victimised for doing well you are being asked to contribute to a better society.

The exact people you quote are being taxed at currently penal rates, these are people who have worked hard all their lives and progressed in their careers to enable themselves to have a comfortable retirement and not be a burden on the state.

If we see people like that getting hammered due to their foresight and adherence to strict budgeting throughout their livers then what is the point of us working ourselves into a position similarly to then have the wheels pulled out from under ? remember these are the squeezed middle who try to do the right thing and carry the can significantly with the amount of taxes they pay over their working lives. These are not people who have had fortunes handed to them or left in inheritance to them but have genuinely worked themselves into what should be a good situation.

We all understand that their is a percentage of people in society who are not as fortunate for whatever reason and will always require the state to lend a hand, no one wishes to beggar these people and society needs these people to thrive if we are to have a functioning and stable future.

Are we to do it by further deductions from this squeezed middle that ultimately will see people wondering if they may as well just bump along and not push or attain their ultimate potential because they see it as not worth it in the long run?

When is enough, enough?

[SydneyRover]

My heart bleeds for you dd, did you address the bit about getting a better education at no extra cost that helped put you there?

[BillyStubbsTears]

  Yep Billy, we have the returns of our fathers the best generation that this country ever had, its not our fault your lot have made a mess of it since the 1980s, buck up get going, heads down arses up and you might enjoy the fruits of your labour.
 If you carry on snorting powder, working from home, less hours, sitting on motorways and stopping people from getting to work and listening to the left loonies its going to get worse buddy.
 And by the way, if you want a good pension you need to put a lot of money in it over your working life.
 

I'm not sure what's more depressing here. How little you actually understand, or how rancid your horrible attitude is to people working hard to pay your state pension.

You want to know why the country is in such a mess? A great Economist once said "Productivity isn't everything. But in the long run, it's nearly everything."

Look here
https://mobile.twitter.com/RichardALJones/status/1618880919674421248/photo/1

We are now earning 22% less for every hour worked than we should be.

Ask yourself what happened in 2010 that put us on this disastrous path just as we were starting to recover from the Global Financial Crash. And which side of the political argument those people who get their daily dose of shit poured into their heads by Mike Graham support.

[danumdon]

What would you like me to say?

I consider my country educated me and i'm repaying it by paying ludicrous amounts of tax and NI,

MY observation of you is that you come across as politically driven to see to it that we have a society that gets dumbed down to the lowest common denominator, you would rather see people who have worked for their wellbeing struck and dragged down so we all have nothing rather than try to convince society that we all need to work and strive harder so we all do well. Something i totally disagree with, i want to see people do well to act as good examples to others who can achieve the same with drive and effort and not excepting mediocrity.

[SydneyRover]

What would you like me to say?

I consider my country educated me and i'm repaying it by paying ludicrous amounts of tax and NI,

MY observation of you is that you come across as politically driven to see to it that we have a society that gets dumbed down to the lowest common denominator, you would rather see people who have worked for their wellbeing struck and dragged down so we all have nothing rather than try to convince society that we all need to work and strive harder so we all do well. Something i totally disagree with, i want to see people do well to act as good examples to others who can achieve the same with drive and effort and not excepting mediocrity.
[/quote

I don't think any of your many many observations of me have been correct to date dd, my politics are due to me wanting a more equal society and I place my vote, efforts and some resources to further that goal.

Politics is the main opportunity to change and improve society and your jaundiced view of politicians only demonstrates ignorance.

If you want to see people do well maybe you should strive to give all people the same opportunity. To understand this you need to get your head around social mobility and how it works but mainly how it doesn't work.

[BobG]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

It's not debateable.

I don't behave like the Daily Mail

BobG

[drfchound]

Syd, how would you draw the line at which a pensioner would be classed as being wealthy.

Come on Syd, I really would value your opinion on where the line should be.

[BobG]

Does it matter when we are discussing principles? Too much detail too soon is no way to explore options.

BobG

[Sprotyrover]

Regardless of that demographic being the "wealthiest age group in the nation"(debatable) i was under the impression that pensioners had the triple lock because as a demographic they were not in a position to be able to deal with inflation rises like the rest of us who can change careers or work harder if it suits, Its not like they can all go back to work and earn some extra!

I'd imagine there is a sizable percentage who have no private provision and have to make do with the state handout.

Should we all start castigating these people because they got an inflation busting rise?

No just do what it says in the article and means test pensions so that those wealthy ones, the ones that don't need the money don't get the money, simple.

I don’t profess to know your situation but you are either drawing or in for some pension payments, should you be means tested?

Where do you draw the line, do we penalise someone for making prudent decisions decades aga?

correct on first count, you don't know, and incorrect on the second I do not.

Those that are classed as wealthy which is relative of course are not being penalised, they gained their wealth in a country that has, with some exceptions, educated them with some provided with a better level of education inc facilities and teachers at no extra cost. They are given opportunities to gain further education, access to health services and protection such as it is.

Is it asking too much that those that can afford it support those that cannot? You are not being victimised for doing well you are being asked to contribute to a better society.

You have every right to moan Sydders!
To be eligible for Age Pension you must be Age Pension age and meet some other rules. On 1 July 2021, Age Pension age increased to 66 years and 6 months for people born from 1 July 1955 to 31 December 1956, inclusive. If your birthdate is on or after 1 January 1957, you'll have to wait until you turn 67.