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I think it's a manifestation of weakness. The Tories have been struggling to make the economy work as they used to.They are struggling to make the economy grow. Too few people are feeling the benefit. So they keep changing leader, trying to find a solution.The danger is they'll keep pushing right looking for an answer.
Far right wing parties are making serious inroads in several European countries, and it’s happening here now.I can see Reform continuing to get stronger and stronger as support for the Tories dries up.
By God, we're in the shit if the Lib Dems become the main party of opposition.This is the party that showed themselves to be a bunch of traitors and snake oil salesmen in 2010.They then elected a raving lunatic as leader, followed by a leader who repeatedly chucked himself into Lake Windermere despite it being full of turds.Jesus wept.
Quote from: scawsby steve on June 08, 2024, 07:27:59 pmBy God, we're in the shit if the Lib Dems become the main party of opposition.This is the party that showed themselves to be a bunch of traitors and snake oil salesmen in 2010.They then elected a raving lunatic as leader, followed by a leader who repeatedly chucked himself into Lake Windermere despite it being full of turds.Jesus wept.Whereas the Tories would be fine as an Opposition because...
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 08, 2024, 07:32:33 pmQuote from: scawsby steve on June 08, 2024, 07:27:59 pmBy God, we're in the shit if the Lib Dems become the main party of opposition.This is the party that showed themselves to be a bunch of traitors and snake oil salesmen in 2010.They then elected a raving lunatic as leader, followed by a leader who repeatedly chucked himself into Lake Windermere despite it being full of turds.Jesus wept.Whereas the Tories would be fine as an Opposition because...Where have I said that the Tories will be fine as leaders of the Opposition? I think they're shite as well.Now, do you think that the Lib Dems would be good as leaders of the Opposition?
I read something t'other day suggesting it is possible, although not probable, that after the election the Liberal Democrat Party will form His Majesty's Loyal Opposition. That would be an Earth shattering event that would. BobG
Quote from: tommy toes on June 08, 2024, 06:11:12 pmFar right wing parties are making serious inroads in several European countries, and it’s happening here now.I can see Reform continuing to get stronger and stronger as support for the Tories dries up.That's the question for moderate Tories.If the Tory party does evaporate, do you find that Farage's lot are more appealing to you than Starmer's Labour?
Quote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 08, 2024, 06:17:54 pmQuote from: tommy toes on June 08, 2024, 06:11:12 pmFar right wing parties are making serious inroads in several European countries, and it’s happening here now.I can see Reform continuing to get stronger and stronger as support for the Tories dries up.That's the question for moderate Tories.If the Tory party does evaporate, do you find that Farage's lot are more appealing to you than Starmer's Labour?Absolutely notOn the same vein how do left wingers feel about that Tory centre ground being taken by labour? Where's the real left wing alternative? What happens if labour do go with more left wing policies than they appear to be proposing, do the former Tories leave and go well where?Lots of change ahead.
Quote from: big fat yorkshire pudding on June 10, 2024, 12:50:11 pmQuote from: BillyStubbsTears on June 08, 2024, 06:17:54 pmQuote from: tommy toes on June 08, 2024, 06:11:12 pmFar right wing parties are making serious inroads in several European countries, and it’s happening here now.I can see Reform continuing to get stronger and stronger as support for the Tories dries up.That's the question for moderate Tories.If the Tory party does evaporate, do you find that Farage's lot are more appealing to you than Starmer's Labour?Absolutely notOn the same vein how do left wingers feel about that Tory centre ground being taken by labour? Where's the real left wing alternative? What happens if labour do go with more left wing policies than they appear to be proposing, do the former Tories leave and go well where?Lots of change ahead.I think that's precisely the point BFYP.The real political divide, ever since Trump showed that a criminal populist could get elected, is no longer the old centre-right/centre-left that we've had across the West since the War.It's now a split between Far Right Populists Vs ...something else. The Far Left want the "something else" to be a Far Left alternative and really draw up the battle lines for a repeat of the Socialism Vs Fascism fight that dominated the second quarter of the 20th Century.Me, I'd prefer the alternative to be a broad coalition of the political centre-right and centre-left. Not necessarily because I think there are better ideas there than there are further to the Left. More because that grouping has more chance of winning enough votes over the long term to neutralise the Populist Far Right.I don't know if Team Starmer has enough strategic vision to see that is the fight that is coming. But where they are positioning themselves is exactly where they need to be to give moderate Tory voters a home when the Tories implode after the Election. The alternative is to push those moderate Tories into the arms of Farage.
Meant to add. Among lots of other reasons, that's another one to add to the argument about why Labour will absolutely not veer off to the Left after they take power.