raoul moat stand off

[pkt_drfc]

True bits in that interview he is going to get pulled apart for by the papers

[Filo]

jucyberry wrote:

 all that is ever joked about is the way it shrinks a mans tackle,

OK, who`s been spiking my drinks with steroids!

[Jonathan]

The radio station should be reprimanded for encouraging Gazza to make a fool of himself in public for that length of time. The guy clearly needs help and listening to that is painful. It's impossible not to laugh at parts of it but it's very sad really and it's not right for broadcasters to make fun of fragile people like that.

[DubaiRover]

Gazza is still a genius.

\"knowing my luck he would miss\" and \"do us a favour will ya,put the cheque in the post\"

Proper belly laugh at them 2, why has he not got his own tv show?

I know I shouldnt but I would love to w**kered with Gazza.

[MrFrost]

What I find funny is that he said \"he drove down\". In that state?!

[Filo]

All those wasted Police man hours negotiating, what was there to negotiate for half of the night? The blokes cornered and pointing a shotgun at his own head, it would have took 10 minutes to sort out, tell him he`s got three options.

1) Are you going to do it

2) are the police going to do it

3) are you going to put the gun down and surrender


Give him 10 minutes to decide or option 2 kicks in automatically, Job done and thousands saved in police overtime!

[keyser_soze]

I can't help but wonder if Spain should've taken Raul to the World Cup finals, he might go missing but he's got a more lethal shot than Torres.

[not on facebook]

so now a tazzer gun was used by the police last nite

question...if you was holding a gun to your head and you pulled the trigger 'BANG' why was there the need for the highly trained police officer to use the tazzer gun?

iam no expert on this matter but i cant just picture the need for the tazzer gun at that moment in time.

so if the tazzer gun was used before the gun went 'BANG' why did the highly trained police officer feal the need to use it?

its been said all along that the police will not shoot unless they see moat point his gun in their direction bascially,and if that was the case then moat WOULD have been shot dead there and then no disscussion

after watching that press conference the chief police women
sue sim looks very uncomfortable and her conterpart the way he was putting/highlighting the problems with the case across leaves questions to be asked.

iam going to have a punt in the dark here, and say the tazzer gun officer was acting on his own,thought he saw something a movement it was dark lashing it down.

so moat gets tazzered then shots himself either on purpose
or a body reaction to the tazzer hitting him.

to which the shit hits the fan

[not on facebook]

been watching alot of this on sky news all week and you have to say reporters such as that kate burley were getting on my tits alot of the time with some of the silly questions they was asking the locals....'media whores' is the phrase iam looking for.

i got the impression that the news channels wanted this type of ending for more viewer ratings.

think where the northumbria police did come out on top was keeping the skyhelicopter at a 10mile radius away from the scene last nite,unlike in america it would have been documentated live as it happens for all to see

[Jonathan]

It's a strange one. As with most major incidents there's a voyeuristic desire to see and hear all the details and finer points to gain a picture of how everything unfolded. I've found myself watching and reading a lot of information on it today but when I stop and think about it I can't think why. I'm not from Rothbury, I don't know Raoul Moat or anyone connected to him and I don't care about his well-being but there has been so much of a frenzy created around the whole thing that I still want to know how it ended. I dare say if there was a video of it on youtube I'd watch it!

Predictably the blame-game had already started long before he was caught and the murmurings of discontent had surfaced about the police response, similar to the Derrick Bird case. That's just the way it is in this country, stories have to shift emphasis to keep people interested and, if there's a key figure or establishment to blame, all the better because that really strikes a chord.

For my part I think the police have had a very difficult job in both cases. Once they found Moat they were on a hiding to nothing almost. They managed to contain him for six hours in an attempt to persuade him to surrender peacefully and in the end he has ended up dead, something he promised when he set out. If they had managed to catch him before this then there would be numerous calls to highlight the burden on the tax payer of keeping a clearly bad man in prison long-term, not least as he has already been proved he cannot be rehabilitated into society. As it is, there already seems to be a shift towards portraying him as a tragic figure, something that (by definition at least) he is absolutely not.

The use of the Taser seems suspect but no details have been released yet of the context within which it was used, no doubt that will be saved for the Sunday papers. Basically I trust that the police acted in good faith, even if a mistake was made, and the ultimate outcome is that Moat has been stopped with no further harm being caused to innocent people. Maybe this isn't the complete success that was aimed for, but after a week of reading about the \"fugitive gunman,\" \"psychotic killer\" and more recently \"mohican madman\" (The Sun) it seems like something to be grateful for.

[DubaiRover]

I think he was quite a clever guy as this picture indicates.

[not on facebook]

very good points jonathan and all are well put down

all along this moat chap as said 'he dont trust any police'
the police have drummed it into us that they 'do not want to harm moat' they will 'talk to him' they want to bring moat in,
'moat you have a future'

from looking at the picture NOW moat could well have had a point about not trusting police to extent with his life.

northumbria will not will not miss people like moat for sure.

but as for northumbria police they are here to protect and serve,they did the protect part more than ok its just the serve part where it seems they have scored a possible massive own goal.this own goal was not scored in the last minute of the game but looks like it was scored from before
the kick off.

what gets my goat is that if is deemed they have scored a massive own goal, you can bet your last dollar that it will
all be diluted down as much as possible and maybe nothing learnt form the whole case,swept away under the carpet like.

[BobG]

Not compleyely on topic, I know, but did you spot on today's teletext (!!) hat two coppers in, I think, Newcastle, have been 'reprimanded' for selling guns that had been handed in to the local cops.

How the hell can anyone trust the police when a) they do things like that, and, b) when they're caught they don't even have their wrists slapped.

I would have thought that doing something like that would warrant a 5 year stretch at the very least.

BobG

[Boomstick]

Ok then.
Who is going to play Raoul Moat in the film?
Jason Statham?, Clive Owen?, Daniel Craig?, Colin Farrell?, Ranulph Fiennes?, Vinnie Jones?, Tom Hardy?

[not on facebook]

i have been split down the middle about the police in our
country as you have some good ones and bad ones,they do a good job and a bad job.

after taking all the info in about this high profile moat case
from my side of the fence it dont look good for nothumbria police or any police force.

for sure that chief policewomen sue sim is acting on orders
from above but how on earth can the coroner give out details of moats death and not mention that a taser gun has been used
and TWICE at that,if you had been tasered it would leave marks on your body.

its starting to smell of a cover up to some extent,this is where the police should be HONEST as how can you trust them in
future.tghe police are playing on the time scale thing as by time full inquiry has been done moat will be in long gone past.

think the fact that police could not find moat was his downfall
as police will be happy he cant talk about his evasion.

ok moat was a loon and the outcome was more than what he deserved,but the way it seems the police have gone about their
part in this case is NOT what joe public deserve

[Snods Shinpad 2]

I wonder why plod didn't lace Moat's sandwiches and water with a powerful tranquilizer and just sit back doing crosswords until he was knocked out?

Maybe that's too low-tech and not Hollywood enough for Northumberland Police and Sky News though.

[Sprotyrover]

Hot off the press! Sue SIM alias lady Tottington the temporary Chief Constable of Toonland is under scrutiny after her antics on friday night/ Saturday Morning, apparently when Gazza turned up pissed in Rothbury and started behaving in 'Gazza' fashion she was at the silver command suite, \"Right\" she screamed \"its enough that the press are having a field day taking the piss out of my hairdo,now that fat lard has turned up and is making us look even stupider,Zap the Ginger Tw*t now\".

The rest my friends is history.  

[not on facebook]

when gazza tunrned up the media should have had a quite word in
his ear to take backwards steps back to newcastle and just ignore him instead of letting him have 5mins

any fool could see and hear he was in a rite state with him sen


the bit about putting sleeping drugs into his food water seems a very good idea,police just sit back and wait for eye lids to drop.

[Jonathan]

Funnily enough the idea of sedating him does seem plausible, although I suppose the worry with drugging him would be if it causes him to be confused and exacerbates the danger he poses to himself and others. It would be hard to predict the individual reaction to any kind of drug (we all have different tolerance levels and reactive behaviour patterns) and if it went wrong they would be absolutely crucified for it!

On BobG's point regarding corruption within the police force, we have to remember that policemen and women are human beings and all humans are susceptible to making mistakes and behaving poorly. These incidents will always exist and will be newsworthy, but I believe they are minority cases. The fact that they may go unpunished is certainly a problem but seperate to the point I'm trying to make. The police have a very difficult job, not least because we all sit back and criticise the way in which they do it, but unfortunately many of us will experience a time when we have to call 999 and rely upon them for help. The police as a body are far from perfect, but they are carrying out a service in our interest, similar to the health and fire services. They will never be rid of bad individuals and I don't think you can ever fully trust anyone outside your inner circle, but do I trust that they are generally acting in my interest? Yes. Would I call on them if I was in a situation that required their help? Yes. So I'm loathe to jump on the bandwagon and criticise.

[not on facebook]

yes the police do have a hard job that is FACT,and true at sometimes in our life will all dial 999 asking for police help
for whatever reason.

as you said there is mainly good bobbys but there will allways be some wrong erns.

the worrying thing is this moat case was on national tv for the whole country to watch
unfold and make up its own mind,to which it seems police are trying to pull a fast one.

now this is not a couple of bad bobbys pulling the strings here its the brass at the top and if they think they will\\can get away with it when the spotlight of the nation
is upon them what message does that send out i ask

[Pintolager]

Whatever the full facts of this sad case and whatever mistakes the Police have made and the blame some people want to put on them whether just or unjust, they are always going to want to cover their backs and save their careers, so while I understand your point Oslo about the need for honesty, that will never happen. I am not a big fan of the Police force myself, but I can understand the pressures they are under day to day and this case only magnifies their roles.

[Thinwhiteduke]

To be honest Im glad Moat blew his own brains out, regardless of whether the Tazer helped that situation along or not.

Hey. Even his own Mother said he'd be better off dead.

He was of no worth to soceity, and would likely have cost a fortune to keep in either a High Security Prison, or, more likely, a Mental Hospital for the rest of his life. Good riddance.

[BobG]

That may all be very, very true TWD, but we all set ourselves up for the ultimate nightmare if we collectively decide to pick and choose who is worth saving and who is not. Nazi Germany decided that Albert Einstein was an untermensch so they got rid of him. Society allowed that to happen. If we start picking and choosing, sure as eggs are eggs, one day it will be you and me that are chosen for the chop. Not a good idea at all. The cost of a prison place is a smal price to pay.

BobG

[RobTheRover]

Boomstick wrote:

Ok then.
Who is going to play Raoul Moat in the film?
Jason Statham?, Clive Owen?, Daniel Craig?, Colin Farrell?, Ranulph Fiennes?, Vinnie Jones?, Tom Hardy?

I thought Michael Sheen got every job going these days?

Anyway, back to the tazer.  A few folks on here have said that the tazer paralyses.   I'm almost certain that the tazer does the opposite, and sends muscles into spasm, causing them to contract to the point the tasered person can not voluntarily move.  Surely, if he was taxered just before the shotgun went off, could this mean that his trigger finger muscles contracted too?

RIP Big Vern

And on a football theme, and specifically the gallows humour often found on the terraces, does anyone expect some songs to be written and sung at Newcastle fans based on Raoul Moat and his shooting ability?

[Thinwhiteduke]

Boomstick wrote:

Ok then.
Who is going to play Raoul Moat in the film?
Jason Statham?, Clive Owen?, Daniel Craig?, Colin Farrell?, Ranulph Fiennes?, Vinnie Jones?, Tom Hardy?

Steve Brooker?

[not on facebook]

on the mother of moat and what she said about moat been better
off dead....it seems that that testement would not have held up
in the courts as she is a mentally ill women....a certian newspaper got hold of that info and went to press  without
checking the mental state of the mother.

back to the police in this mess,the mess is their own doing
they kept on telling us it was a hard case,fair enough buts thats what they are paid to do its their profession

iam begining to wonder about that statement about moat been a
danger to wider public now.

but most important from what you can pick up its not looking good for the police on how they set their stall out on..in...during moats case

now think down the line sooner or later another person
with problems could well go down the same road as moat to extent that person is getting haunted down

and the outcome of the possible above such case could all well
depend on how that persons thoughts on the moat case,paying special attention on how northumbria police conducted them sens

you can see the type of picture iam trying to paint here

[grayx]

Thinwhiteduke wrote:

To be honest Im glad Moat blew his own brains out, regardless of whether the Tazer helped that situation along or not.

Hey. Even his own Mother said he'd be better off dead.

He was of no worth to soceity, and would likely have cost a fortune to keep in either a High Security Prison, or, more likely, a Mental Hospital for the rest of his life. Good riddance.

Thankyou, at long last someone talking sense. A murderer is now no longer a threat to society. I personally don't give a shite if a tazer caused this , or if an owl farted & a copper shot at it & hit Moat instead. As soon as he refused to put down his gun, the police were justified to shoot him. End of, sorry Gazza.

[NigelJ]

The whole episode is a sad one.

However, why do we need to find someone to blame all the time? Its happened. Lets just put it down to experience, and maybe it won't happen again. Maybe it will, but that, is just Human Nature. We make mistakes. We make wrong choices.

But no. We'll have a very lengthy inquiry, at huge expense to find out what could have been done differently. And next time, the circumstances will be slightly different, and the whole blame process will start again.

[BLIR]

Apparently the Northumberland Police did everything they could to keep him alive once he had shot himself, the ambulance rushed him to Plymouth A&E

[not on facebook]

from my part its the way northumbria police have gone about
this event that gets my goat,or should i say still going about.
if moat had not shot that police officer how small would the man hunt been for him?

i might be jumping the gun here but for sure they fired the taser at moat,then moat shot himself or it was a body reflex.

why would you need to taser somebody if they shot their head off first?

true enough moat was not rite in the head and not a hero for sure if lead to belive from facebook account

i think alot of people feal pitty for moat due to
how the police went/going about this case and maybe their personal dealings with police.

if the police was honest and straight forward i for sure would not be second guessing this and that about them in the moat events.

if you cant/dont trust the police where do you stand?

this is now't to do with police but it seems moat was asking
for help about a year ago.

the IPCC are asking locals who lived near the incident what they saw or could hear so they can get a picture of the what came first the taser or moats shotgun....why about the two officers who fired the taser or the laods of police who were stood around even the negotiator???

simple 'mums the word'